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Discussion starter · #21 ·
What a great way of separating 3m pounds from 799 rich guys. I'm sure they'll do well by flipping it to another 799 rich guys down the road. The same black stripe on the front is killing me.

Will someone knowledgeable please educated me on how they can squeeze 900HP out of a 3.0 liter V6 at 9000rpm? From what I understand from the tuners, the only way to add meaningful power is keep adding more boost and inject more fuel. But then you seem to reach the limit of 93 octane pump gas before it starts to knock. Hence the need for race fuel to get more HP. So how does Ferrari do this when the 4.0 liter from W1 gets the same 900HP? What does Ferrari know that McLaren doesn't? Surely all else being equal, "there's no replacement for displacement" still some what holds true in the turbo world?
“For maximum performance in all possible conditions, every aspect of the calibration of the engine has been taken to the extreme, focusing in particular on the ignition and injection timing, the number of injection events per stroke and the management of the variable-phase valve timing. The F80 is equipped with the first Ferrari road car engine to benefit from a new approach for statistical knock control, which lets the engine operate even closer to the knock limit, allowing the use of higher combustion chamber pressures than ever (+20% compared with the 296 GTB)”
 
McLaren has been eating Ferrari’s lunch design wise for some time now.

Last Ferrari that I thought actually looked hot was the F8, been downhill since.
I could not agree more. At this point, I still plan to buy my first Ferrari fairly soon but out of all the models I would consider from an aesthetic point of view, only the F8 and 812 GTS remains. Zero interest in anything that came after.
 
“For maximum performance in all possible conditions, every aspect of the calibration of the engine has been taken to the extreme, focusing in particular on the ignition and injection timing, the number of injection events per stroke and the management of the variable-phase valve timing. The F80 is equipped with the first Ferrari road car engine to benefit from a new approach for statistical knock control, which lets the engine operate even closer to the knock limit, allowing the use of higher combustion chamber pressures than ever (+20% compared with the 296 GTB)”
Thanks. Somewhat makes sense. Reads to me basically as, we crank up the boost all the way to the edge until we see knock and then back off, and then go again on the next tank of gas. Still, I doubt McLaren and Lambo and all the aftermarket tuners would have left that much headroom in their ECU tuning, they all have knock sensing and would have pushed pretty close to the edge which seems to be around 800HP for 4.0 liter V8 at 9-10k rpm. If you believe Ferrari's numbers, it seems a big step forward. What do they know that no one else knows? Unless they are cheating by using higher octane gas. I'm skeptical and curious at the same time.
 
Thanks. Somewhat makes sense. Reads to me basically as, we crank up the boost all the way to the edge until we see knock and then back off, and then go again on the next tank of gas. Still, I doubt McLaren and Lambo and all the aftermarket tuners would have left that much headroom in their ECU tuning, they all have knock sensing and would have pushed pretty close to the edge which seems to be around 800HP for 4.0 liter V8 at 9-10k rpm. If you believe Ferrari's numbers, it seems a big step forward. What do they know that no one else knows? Unless they are cheating by using higher octane gas. I'm skeptical and curious at the same time.
Simply put, I believe Ferrari has higher thermal efficiency, especially with the MGU-H
 
With a weight penalty. This engine is around 30kg heavier than the McLaren V6.
It's the same weight as the 296 GTB engine, which is claimed at 185 kg with 22 kg of additional weight for the electric motor. Dunno what is bigger on it, but I'm sure components have to be heavier on it to compensate for the extra 300+ hp or so...
 
Simply put, I believe Ferrari has higher thermal efficiency, especially with the MGU-H
Sorry, things still don't add up for me. Essentially the same engine as 296GTB (650HP), plus 20% more boost, how does it make 900HP? If Ferrari indeed has figured out the next quantum leap in ICE technology, everyone needs to jump on this asap. Can you imagine a 1000HP+ 4.0L McLaren ICE only car as their next super series car without all the electrical weight and complexities? It will sell like hot cakes.

My best GUESS that comes to my mind is Ferrari is really dancing on the edge and temporarily over boosting the engine and back off before too much knocking kills the engine. Being a 1/799 hypercar that won't be driven, reliability is not a huge concern. Maybe the ICE power only last a short while. This aligns with their language about the feature that learns the track and pick the spots for peak power delivery. Or they rely more on battery power than they care to admit. With the V6, the car feels more like an EV with a motor strapped on it than the other way around. I would love to be wrong here.
 
Sorry, things still don't add up for me. Essentially the same engine as 296GTB (650HP), plus 20% more boost, how does it make 900HP? If Ferrari indeed has figured out the next quantum leap in ICE technology, everyone needs to jump on this asap. Can you imagine a 1000HP+ 4.0L McLaren ICE only car as their next super series car without all the electrical weight and complexities? It will sell like hot cakes.

My best GUESS that comes to my mind is Ferrari is really dancing on the edge and temporarily over boosting the engine and back off before too much knocking kills the engine. Being a 1/799 hypercar that won't be driven, reliability is not a huge concern. Maybe the ICE power only last a short while. This aligns with their language about the feature that learns the track and pick the spots for peak power delivery. Or they rely more on battery power than they care to admit. With the V6, the car feels more like an EV with a motor strapped on it than the other way around. I would love to be wrong here.
It's not the same engine as the 296 engine. It has more in common with the 499 engine. Yes, MGU-H F1 cars have 50+% thermal efficiency. Engines like the W1's are closer to 30% in comparison. This requires a MGU-h and an e turbo to achieve, in combination with really good head pre ignition/swirl technology. Only 3 cars that I know of have anything close to a MGU-h. The Mercedes AMG One and the latest C63 AMG, and now this.

The point is, you can obtain this kind of extra performance and efficiency WITH electric recovery.
 
How can a car with 7 e-motors (4 for suspension & 3 for power), even with a V-6, weigh a claimed 3362 lbs / 1525 kgs? The 296 is 3552 lbs / 1611 lgs DIN. I'll bet you it's more like 3700 lbs DIN. And $4M USD!
Carbon tub, additive manufacturing titanium wishbones, lighter CCM-R+ brakes, carbon wheels, no anti roll bars, narrower cockpit/glass, fixed seats. That's to start. Yeah, it's going to be heavier than what Ferrari state, but so was the 296GTB and everything else. This is just off the top of my head from add/delete.
 
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