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Easy answer. The P1. More rare and it is part of the "holy trinity" so it has far more significance in automotive history. Down the line it will likely follow a similar appreciation curve of an F1.

The P1 GT being the most desirable and valuable model as only 1 was ever made. The P1 LM follows that with only 5 in existence.

Add in the fact that McLaren is hybridizing their fleet and the P1 was 10 years ahead of this curve with a TT V8 with integrated electric systems and you can see why this car will be held in very high regard in the future.

The SF90 is TT V8 hybrid. P1 paved the way for this.

People are all sleeping on P1's these days like they did on the F1 back in the day. The F1's didn't even sell out and now they are fetching 20 million. Leno has a P1 for a reason.

Remember, the P1 on Trofeo R's was faster than the Laferrari and the 918 on track and in a straight line up top.

The Senna on the other hand does not really have any true rivals. Styles make fights and rich guys in 30 years will want to race P1's and LaFerrari's and 918 Spyders. The Senna doesn't really fit in within this context. It is very similar in platform to the 720s which has sold exceptionally well. The 765LT seems to outperform or Match the Senna in many aspects as well and is far more steerable. 765LT values are more likely to rise in my estimation.

Of course full carbon body Senna's and super unique specs will hold and gain value, but people will kick themselves for not buying the P1 for 1 million when they had the chance.
 

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Easy answer. The P1. More rare and it is part of the "holy trinity" so it has far more significance in automotive history. Down the line it will likely follow a similar appreciation curve of an F1.

The P1 GT being the most desirable and valuable model as only 1 was ever made. The P1 LM follows that with only 5 in existence.

Add in the fact that McLaren is hybridizing their fleet and the P1 was 10 years ahead of this curve with a TT V8 with integrated electric systems and you can see why this car will be held in very high regard in the future.

The SF90 is TT V8 hybrid. P1 paved the way for this.

People are all sleeping on P1's these days like they did on the F1 back in the day. The F1's didn't even sell out and now they are fetching 20 million. Leno has a P1 for a reason.

Remember, the P1 on Trofeo R's was faster than the Laferrari and the 918 on track and in a straight line up top.

The Senna on the other hand does not really have any true rivals. Styles make fights and rich guys in 30 years will want to race P1's and LaFerrari's and 918 Spyders. The Senna doesn't really fit in within this context. It is very similar in platform to the 720s which has sold exceptionally well. The 765LT seems to outperform or Match the Senna in many aspects as well and is far more steerable. 765LT values are more likely to rise in my estimation.

Of course full carbon body Senna's and super unique specs will hold and gain value, but people will kick themselves for not buying the P1 for 1 million when they had the chance.
P1 weight - 3285 Speedtails power density is 4x of the cells in the P1
Senna - 3029
The mold is broken - there will never be a more track focussed car than a street legal Senna.
P1 is gorgeous vs Senna intensity.
 

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P1 weight - 3285 Speedtails power density is 4x of the cells in the P1
Senna - 3029
The mold is broken - there will never be a more track focussed car than a street legal Senna.
P1 is gorgeous vs Senna intensity.
I can’t argue with that
 

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P1 weight - 3285 Speedtails power density is 4x of the cells in the P1
Senna - 3029
The mold is broken - there will never be a more track focussed car than a street legal Senna.
P1 is gorgeous vs Senna intensity.
Valkyrie is a more track focused car than Senna, unless you're talking for McLarens
 

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I think what Champagne612 is trying to say is that there will never be a more track focused pure internal combustion engine hypercar than a street legal Senna.

The Valkyrie will break many records I think, but it's the next generation of hybrid hypercars. I think the days of a non-assisted pure engine hypercar is numbered.

I recently did a corner balance alignment on my LM and it came out to 2912lbs with a full tank of gas.
 

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Easy answer. The P1. More rare and it is part of the "holy trinity" so it has far more significance in automotive history. Down the line it will likely follow a similar appreciation curve of an F1.

The P1 GT being the most desirable and valuable model as only 1 was ever made. The P1 LM follows that with only 5 in existence.

Add in the fact that McLaren is hybridizing their fleet and the P1 was 10 years ahead of this curve with a TT V8 with integrated electric systems and you can see why this car will be held in very high regard in the future.

The SF90 is TT V8 hybrid. P1 paved the way for this.

People are all sleeping on P1's these days like they did on the F1 back in the day. The F1's didn't even sell out and now they are fetching 20 million. Leno has a P1 for a reason.

Remember, the P1 on Trofeo R's was faster than the Laferrari and the 918 on track and in a straight line up top.

The Senna on the other hand does not really have any true rivals. Styles make fights and rich guys in 30 years will want to race P1's and LaFerrari's and 918 Spyders. The Senna doesn't really fit in within this context. It is very similar in platform to the 720s which has sold exceptionally well. The 765LT seems to outperform or Match the Senna in many aspects as well and is far more steerable. 765LT values are more likely to rise in my estimation.

Of course full carbon body Senna's and super unique specs will hold and gain value, but people will kick themselves for not buying the P1 for 1 million when they had the chance.
Absolutely agreed.

Looking back on history, I'm confident the desire goes F1>P1>[whatever else]. Like the F1, it'll get out performed by its own lineage, and that's fine, they are both watershed moments for McLaren and there won't be another like them. Likely safe to say the days of $1.0M P1's are gone.

I'm equally perplexed where the Senna lives in history and thus value long term. They are epic as an instrument, and yet there is no disguising they are essentially a re-bodied and massively tweaked 720S, I don't believe they've seen the last of their price swings down and up. It kills me they didn't homologate new headlights for the Senna. P1 is the proud daddy of any late model McLaren, and F1 is grandaddy looking on from a distance and I think history will always hold them in that light.
 
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Looking back on history, I'm confident the desire goes F1>P1>[whatever else].
Y'know, funny thing, but as a new (1 year now) McLaren owner I barely know what a P1 is. The F1, yes, of course. Porsche 918, ditto. But I wouldn't count your chickens on future value of the P1 based on the F1.

Also, who cares what the future value is? Drive it like you stole it! ;-)
 

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First of all, I want to say that the P1 is a very exciting car to drive. Lots of whooshes and when the turbo kicks in, the acceleration will bring lots of smiles to anyone sitting in the cabin.

But I want to point out that the P1 is based on the 12C, just as the Senna is based on the 720S platform. I'm assuming you probably didn't buy your P1 as the first owner, so you might not have the context and historical background on how the P1 was created. The P1 concept was originally created as a Group C hypercar concept based on the 12C chassis with no hybrid technology (very similar to the Senna in this regard). When Mclaren discovered that Ferrari was going to follow Porsche's footstep and incorporate hybrid technology in its hypercar, they scrambled and added a hybrid system to the P1 last minute. The 12C carbon tub simply didn't have enough room fit the hybrid tech in the right place.

So how do you know if the P1 is based heavily on the 12C chassis? Look no further than the placement of its battery pack. It is placed high up in the car, above the fuel tank, behind the driver's head. Why would you want to place your heaviest part so high up? You wouldn't want to unless you were forced to. Now look at the 918 or the LaFerrari, both of which were created from the ground up with its own unique carbon chassis, their battery are placed in the lowest point of the car at the bottom.

The P1 received new headlight because Mclaren got criticized a lot in their design of the MP4-12C. Frank Stephenson's first attempt in the MP4-12C was too conservative and was criticized heavily. He was forced to recreate a new front look for Mclaren and the P1 was the result. From an exterior design perspective, I think the P1 was a home run. His design on the P1 laid the design groundwork for all Mclaren models that followed afterwards.

Absolutely agreed.

Looking back on history, I'm confident the desire goes F1>P1>[whatever else]. Like the F1, it'll get out performed by its own lineage, and that's fine, they are both watershed moments for McLaren and there won't be another like them. Likely safe to say the days of $1.0M P1's are gone.

I'm equally perplexed where the Senna lives in history and thus value long term. They are epic as an instrument, and yet there is no disguising they are essentially a re-bodied and massively tweaked 720S, I don't believe they've seen the last of their price swings down and up. It kills me they didn't homologate new headlights for the Senna. P1 is the proud daddy of any late model McLaren, and F1 is grandaddy looking on from a distance and I think history will always hold them in that light.
 

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First of all, I want to say that the P1 is a very exciting car to drive. Lots of whooshes and when the turbo kicks in, the acceleration will bring lots of smiles to anyone sitting in the cabin.

But I want to point out that the P1 is based on the 12C, just as the Senna is based on the 720S platform. I'm assuming you probably didn't buy your P1 as the first owner, so you might not have the context and historical background on how the P1 was created. The P1 concept was originally created as a Group C hypercar concept based on the 12C chassis with no hybrid technology (very similar to the Senna in this regard). When Mclaren discovered that Ferrari was going to follow Porsche's footstep and incorporate hybrid technology in its hypercar, they scrambled and added a hybrid system to the P1 last minute. The 12C carbon tub simply didn't have enough room fit the hybrid tech in the right place.

So how do you know if the P1 is based heavily on the 12C chassis? Look no further than the placement of its battery pack. It is placed high up in the car, above the fuel tank, behind the driver's head. Why would you want to place your heaviest part so high up? You wouldn't want to unless you were forced to. Now look at the 918 or the LaFerrari, both of which were created from the ground up with its own unique carbon chassis, their battery are placed in the lowest point of the car at the bottom.

The P1 received new headlight because Mclaren got criticized a lot in their design of the MP4-12C. Frank Stephenson's first attempt in the MP4-12C was too conservative and was criticized heavily. He was forced to recreate a new front look for Mclaren and the P1 was the result. From an exterior design perspective, I think the P1 was a home run. His design on the P1 laid the design groundwork for all Mclaren models that followed afterwards.
Don't take that as any sort of dig at the Senna, and I'm aware that the P1 is based on the 12C. I don't think McLaren ever attempted to disguise that. Good feedback and detail.

I remember seeing Autocar's statement on a non-Hybrid P1 originally, but my understanding was that was not a mid-stream scramble but more of a earlier idea that was scraped and working within 12C foundation was always the plan. I would welcome any reading material on that.

Assuming I'm looking at the right IG, you're in LA. I'm out your way a fair bit and I'd love to check out the LM and the CGT, I'm debating between a CGT or a Senna addition and which to go first.
 

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Yes, the plan was always to use 12C platform for the P1, WITHOUT the hybrid system.

And don't forget the scramble to run an off-the-shelf Trofeo R tire that is 10mm narrower (305/30/20) and without the "MC1" marking at the time (the right size is available now since the Senna runs that size), and of course, the ring lap debacle. Too many interesting behind the scene info to share here.

PM me on IG or here, would love to share with you my experience on these cars.

Don't take that as any sort of dig at the Senna, and I'm aware that the P1 is based on the 12C. I don't think McLaren ever attempted to disguise that. Good feedback and detail.

I remember seeing Autocar's statement on a non-Hybrid P1 originally, but my understanding was that was not a mid-stream scramble but more of a earlier idea that was scraped and working within 12C foundation was always the plan. I would welcome any reading material on that.

Assuming I'm looking at the right IG, you're in LA. I'm out your way a fair bit and I'd love to check out the LM and the CGT, I'm debating between a CGT or a Senna addition and which to go first.
 

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P1 weight - 3285 Speedtails power density is 4x of the cells in the P1
Senna - 3029
The mold is broken - there will never be a more track focussed car than a street legal Senna.
P1 is gorgeous vs Senna intensity.
You left out some important specs.

P1 - top speed 217 mph HP 903 664 lb-ft

Senna - top speed 208 HP 789 590 lb-ft




While I agree that the Senna is magnificent, it's significance in automotive history and Mclaren's history is not in the realm of the P1.

Please recall that the F1 was released in 1993. The P1 was released exactly 20 years later in 2013 as a direct successor to the F1 which is widely regarded as the greatest car ever produced.

Please also recall that the ACTUAL car that Ayrton Senna developed while he was still alive was the Acura NSX. The Senna pays homage to Ayrton but the NSX was the car he developed.

How Ayrton Senna made the Acura NSX exceptional

Furthermore, the P1 introduced the design language aesthetic that McLaren still uses a decade later.

When the P1 was produced in 2013, McLaren Automotive was a new brand entering into the supercar arena and it's founder Ron Dennis was the driving force behind the P1. He literally states the the P1 is the successor to the F1.

When asked about the P1's Ferrari rival, which was being unveiled at precisely the same moment. ‘Well,' Ron smiled, ‘all I can say is that there's nothing la la about our car...'


The involvement of Ron Dennis in the P1, the Mclaren F1 racing team principal and McLaren Auto's founder, cannot be overstated in terms of historical significance to the brand.

I could wax poetic but in short, the P1 is the answer.
 

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Autocar sums it up well in this video comparison. Listen closely to what he says about the P1 and then the Senna.


Look no further than the Logos of the F1 and the P1. They are practically identical. This is no accident.

Someday soon collectors will realize how special the P1 is. I've already seen people waking up to this in recent months.

Hear me now and believe me later...
 

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First of all, I want to say that the P1 is a very exciting car to drive. Lots of whooshes and when the turbo kicks in, the acceleration will bring lots of smiles to anyone sitting in the cabin.

But I want to point out that the P1 is based on the 12C, just as the Senna is based on the 720S platform. I'm assuming you probably didn't buy your P1 as the first owner, so you might not have the context and historical background on how the P1 was created. The P1 concept was originally created as a Group C hypercar concept based on the 12C chassis with no hybrid technology (very similar to the Senna in this regard). When Mclaren discovered that Ferrari was going to follow Porsche's footstep and incorporate hybrid technology in its hypercar, they scrambled and added a hybrid system to the P1 last minute. The 12C carbon tub simply didn't have enough room fit the hybrid tech in the right place.

So how do you know if the P1 is based heavily on the 12C chassis? Look no further than the placement of its battery pack. It is placed high up in the car, above the fuel tank, behind the driver's head. Why would you want to place your heaviest part so high up? You wouldn't want to unless you were forced to. Now look at the 918 or the LaFerrari, both of which were created from the ground up with its own unique carbon chassis, their battery are placed in the lowest point of the car at the bottom.

The P1 received new headlight because Mclaren got criticized a lot in their design of the MP4-12C. Frank Stephenson's first attempt in the MP4-12C was too conservative and was criticized heavily. He was forced to recreate a new front look for Mclaren and the P1 was the result. From an exterior design perspective, I think the P1 was a home run. His design on the P1 laid the design groundwork for all Mclaren models that followed afterwards.
The 3.8 engine block on a P1 specifically designed and strengthened for the P1's larger turbos and Hy-KERS system derived from Formula 1 and is not shared with any other McLaren. It is a different part number. The P1 also has an IPAS system on the steering wheel (aka DRS) derived from Formula 1. The car was in development 5 years before it's release in 2013 and the Hy-KERS was hardly a last minute afterthought. Surely there were multiple versions in development before the release and corporate espionage and disinformation campaigns against Ferrari and Porsche were likely used.

As for the Senna, from what I understand, the Senna shares the platform and even it's engine block with the 720s. The Senna has a revised piston design, and head gasket. The 765LT has the Senna pistons, head gasket and additional fuel and oil pumps that the Senna does not have along with a shorter final drive ratio for enhanced acceleration.

A Senna is much closer to a 720s than a P1 is to a MP4-12c.
 

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As for Nürburgring, here's the video of the Lanzante Modified P1 LM setting a 6:43 laptime.




Chris Harris discusses some of these topics with the McLaren development driver in this video


P1's are special.
 
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