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Discussion Starter #1
My friends say I can sell my contract for October UK delivery for £50k , others say £25k.

I am buying my McLaren to enjoy to the full but what is the reality of premiums?

Anyone know fact from fiction?
 

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My friends say I can sell my contract for October UK delivery for £50k , others say £25k.

I am buying my McLaren to enjoy to the full but what is the reality of premiums?

Anyone know fact from fiction?
Fact,one of the early cars has been sold for £25k premium,which is very annoying for those that have been waiting so long,and there is another option for sale with same premium on pistonheads for a 61reg car.
I think Mclaren have done their best to pick out the early customers.because nobody wants this to happen,but there will always be changes of circumstance in this climate,so its not going to be perfect.Its the ones that have slipped through and are in it for profit that p--s people off.
I have thought about this,and maybe if Mclaren look at the point of view that the first cars might not come with NAV,maybe that contract is with the first owner,and they could make life difficult for the first couple of months if people want try to make profit???Or maybe its too much hassle and we have to live with ,ie market economy
 

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I don't think dealer appreciate flipping for a premium and unless you care little about your reputation, I don't think you would like to do that as a user.
 

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I've been offered $75K USD over sticker for my car by a couple of exotic dealers. No dice.
 

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A McLaren and a production run of just 1000 cars in yr 1 will surely yield a handsome premium. There will be a few flips but most will keep and enjoy their cars.
 

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Premiums are a reality (at least in the U.S.). It seems if you deposit and have patience you can custom-spec at MSRP; if you want early, you're going to be spending an additional $50-$75K and won't be able to spec the car yourself.

I see it two ways - one the dealer is gouging the clientelle based on initial demand (basically "because they can/folks will pay"). Two (and the other (up?)side of the coin) is that the premium-payers are inflating the market-value of the car, and therefore those who pay MSRP are actually getting a bit of a bargain; why do you think Ferraris "hold value" so well? ...because so many people pay premiums to get them that MSRP is - basically - actually a discount.

I don't know how it is in other countries - but in the U.S., car mfg's have zero to do with the client's end purchase (regardless the client - even the one that just jumped to mind - it's by law). So - any "no flip" arrangements, deposits, orders, premiums, resales, whatever you may have - are between clients and dealerships.

Most dealers over here have a no-flip contract of some sort, usually giving them first right of refusal for the first year.
 

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Last I heard was that first year production will be 25% less than planned, i.e. 750 and so even rarer!
 

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Not sure if this is because they can't ramp up production as fast as they expected or because of delays in delivery, i.e. start 3 months late, therefore 25% of year gone.
With the now minimum of an extra month's delay (anybody been told why?) first years production will probably be around 500 - my guess.
 

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a low supply may hold value better but it certainly depends on the demand. You can make one example of a car and if demand is zero, value would not hold well. I would reserve my judgement until I see the first example being flipped online. That would be interesting. All these premiums are big talks but until they sign a fat big cheque on your desk then you start to pop the Dom. I do hear some ridiculous premiums but none transacting.

At the moment, no delivery of actual vehicle and it is all talks and dealers will ask for a premium without even having a car and if some customers come and pay the 75,000 sterling then they go out and search. No real market yet not now over here.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
It SEEMS complete arrogance to me that dealers or manufacturers want to stop cars flipping after they have made £25k and £100k respectively out of 'their' customer, certainly not 'their' car when sold!

Sure can understand the manufacturer wants the cars to go to enthusiasts rather than speculators but it's a free market at the end of the day. They have failed to stop Tom Hartley et al becoming multi millionairs off their high selling prices ( and supply/demand realities)

Anyway yet to see if premiums are fact or fiction!
 

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It SEEMS complete arrogance to me that dealers or manufacturers want to stop cars flipping after they have made £25k and £100k respectively out of 'their' customer, certainly not 'their' car when sold!

Sure can understand the manufacturer wants the cars to go to enthusiasts rather than speculators but it's a free market at the end of the day. They have failed to stop Tom Hartley et al becoming multi millionairs off their high selling prices ( and supply/demand realities)

Anyway yet to see if premiums are fact or fiction!
fiction. A dealer said he would do me a favour by selling me his MP4-12c first batch quota for a fat premium with a discount. I have a quota so I said to him, oh good, I have a better deal for you, I will sell you my quota for 1/2 of what you asked for. Then he didn't say a word... nough said... sure I will sell you mine for what you asked for 50% off... if it's such an easy sell, he would have taken a double up... no go I'd say. Until we see a signed cheque, I wouldn't count on this premium talk. You can ask for the World... then there could be zero buyer.
 

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fiction. A dealer said he would do me a favour by selling me his MP4-12c first batch quota for a fat premium with a discount. I have a quota so I said to him, oh good, I have a better deal for you, I will sell you my quota for 1/2 of what you asked for. Then he didn't say a word... nough said... sure I will sell you mine for what you asked for 50% off... if it's such an easy sell, he would have taken a double up... no go I'd say. Until we see a signed cheque, I wouldn't count on this premium talk. You can ask for the World... then there could be zero buyer.
FACT most exotic cars are sold and bought for way over their list values (as mentioned before Tom Hartley etc). Catitalia you can't declare that this is not happening based on a sample of 1 (you), that is so a spectacularly insignificant sample number that a market researcher or statistician would laugh themselves to death.:D

Funny but all your recent comments have a lot of negativity about them regarding the MP4-12C, would be nice to see some positive ones once in a while (or do you just save them for Ferrari Chat?)
 

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Discussion Starter #14
i NOTICED today Stratstone are advertising for MP12 contracts. Seems there is a market for rich boys who did not place a deposit, and rich girls I guess!
 

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FACT most exotic cars are sold and bought for way over their list values (as mentioned before Tom Hartley etc). Catitalia you can't declare that this is not happening based on a sample of 1 (you), that is so a spectacularly insignificant sample number that a market researcher or statistician would laugh themselves to death.:D

Funny but all your recent comments have a lot of negativity about them regarding the MP4-12C, would be nice to see some positive ones once in a while (or do you just save them for Ferrari Chat?)
My friend, I am not negative towards the MP4-12c. Indeed, I would say quite the opposite. I have very good comments on it. As I say, I love Coke, I also like PEPSI. I love McDonald's and I also like Burger King and I love Morton's and I also like Ruth's Chris and I love MAC and I also like Windows. MP4-12c is a spectacular marvel of engineering and I have repeatedly said that. It is fast, capable and revolutionary. I mean it, carbon tub, dihedral single hinged doors, revolutionary suspension, 3-in-1 capability, the revised version is even better so you can't get a better car in the same niche than McLaren. Ferrari is up there with the F1 legacy and the only serious contender who can ride shoulder to shoulder would be McLaren. As I say, I love Ferrari, I also like McLaren. They can co exist. Unfortunately, I am a mortal who can't afford both but I have a deposit for a McLaren so I am a customer.

As to flipping, I said clearly I would wait before I comment as there are many asking prices and none real over here. No transaction so far and how could you when you are talking about trading on a call option or futures by paying a premium with no physical delivery. I maybe an outlier or the black swan event but as far as I know, the sample size so far is not statistically significant yet to give a mean and a standard deviation (you need the law of large numbers) for us to determine the form of distribution. We need a sample size large enough to make a comment and 1000 cars is rare over the course of a year.

If I have to guess, the normal distribution will be with a mean of some sort of premium but I have to reserve my comment. Plus over here, I don't think I want to flip my quota out. Maybe I should but all the times spent negotiating I will try to work my day job to make better money. I am not good at flipping.

You are right, like the 458, it still trades at a premium. McLaren, most probably but none so far. Fictional referring to the current situation but it changes by the minute.

Please don't get me wrong, if I can get one more car in addition to my 458, I would buy a McLaren period. So I am not at all negative.
 
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