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Read this article today, this will be difficult for McLaren to overcome (need for Capital), will be curious to see how this unfolds, as they will need cash or need to get an infusion.

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1128601_mclaren-sues-creditors-as-insolvency-threatens
This is being discussed on another thread, Richard. :)
McLaren goes to court
In a couple of respects the article is wrong or misleading.
McLaren have not take the creditors to court. They have taken to court the 'Security Agent' (U.S. Bank), which acts as the trustee for the original secured notes. McLaren (thinks it) needs, or at least would like to have, the consent of the Security Agent in order to undertake one of the new funding proposals. For its part, the Security Agent is being pressurised by some fraction of the secured note holders based on the argument that the proposed new funding would violate a covenant of the indenture.
Also, the article seems to confuse the original note holders with the holders of the original note. That is, my understanding is that the parties ('Ad Hoc Noteholders') pressurising U.S. Bank to deny McLaren permission are not or mostly not the original buyers of the notes. Rather, they are hedge funds and distressed debt players who recently have bought the notes at a deep discount and are hoping to force McLaren to do a restructuring that would disproportionately benefit themselves (the noteholders). These guys are about as much long-term investors with a genuine interest in McLaren as the final event in Top Fuel Eliminator is an endurance race.
 

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Hedge funds brokers take over business for their self interests to pocket their money. No interest in vehicle brand to all.
 

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Hedge funds brokers take over business for their self interests to pocket their money. No interest in vehicle brand to all.
Purchasers of distressed debt do what they do because companies over-leverage themselves and don’t generate sufficient cash to cover their needs for liquidity. Distressed debt funds don’t indeed give a rat’s mustache about the goods and services the underlying business make and offer, nor should they. They are compensated by buying low and selling high. They are like scorpions who only know how to sting. Unfortunately McLaren has been walking around barefoot and thus has gotten stung. If it had more cash it would have bought shoes and crushed the scorpion. Now the scorpion has a good chance of crushing it. Live by leverage and die by leverage.
 

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Purchasers of distressed debt do what they do because companies over-leverage themselves and don’t generate sufficient cash to cover their needs for liquidity. Distressed debt funds don’t indeed give a rat’s mustache about the goods and services the underlying business make and offer, nor should they. They are compensated by buying low and selling high. They are like scorpions who only know how to sting. Unfortunately McLaren has been walking around barefoot and thus has gotten stung. If it had more cash it would have bought shoes and crushed the scorpion. Now the scorpion has a good chance of crushing it. Live by leverage and die by leverage.
Very very well put.
 

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This is being discussed on another thread, Richard. :)
McLaren goes to court
In a couple of respects the article is wrong or misleading.
McLaren have not take the creditors to court. They have taken to court the 'Security Agent' (U.S. Bank), which acts as the trustee for the original secured notes. McLaren (thinks it) needs, or at least would like to have, the consent of the Security Agent in order to undertake one of the new funding proposals. For its part, the Security Agent is being pressurised by some fraction of the secured note holders based on the argument that the proposed new funding would violate a covenant of the indenture.
Also, the article seems to confuse the original note holders with the holders of the original note. That is, my understanding is that the parties ('Ad Hoc Noteholders') pressurising U.S. Bank to deny McLaren permission are not or mostly not the original buyers of the notes. Rather, they are hedge funds and distressed debt players who recently have bought the notes at a deep discount and are hoping to force McLaren to do a restructuring that would disproportionately benefit themselves (the noteholders). These guys are about as much long-term investors with a genuine interest in McLaren as the final event in Top Fuel Eliminator is an endurance race.
is there any scenario where you think Mac could be sold? wasn’t there rumors a couple of years ago that Apple was courting? It just seems that Mac will face many challenges as a standalone entity... I am a big supporter of the brand but the challenges seem too high... Maybe its time to sell to BMW?
 
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is there any scenario where you think Mac could be sold? wasn’t there rumors a couple of years ago that Apple was courting? It just seems that Mac will face many challenges as a standalone entity... I am a big supporter of the brand but the challenges seem too high... Maybe its time to sell to BMW?
That would be wonderful. I don’t know how bankruptcy works in the UK, but in the US the debt would be renegotiated, some of it would convert to equity, and a buyer could be found to run the reorganized company. Mac has terrific technology and engineers who would be valuable to the likes of BMW or Mercedes. It just seems to have poor management with a bad business plan that over expanded, over leveraged and mistook hope for a business strategy.
 

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That would be wonderful. I don’t know how bankruptcy works in the UK, but in the US the debt would be renegotiated, some of it would convert to equity, and a buyer could be found to run the reorganized company. Mac has terrific technology and engineers who would be valuable to the likes of BMW or Mercedes. It just seems to have poor management with a bad business plan that over expanded, over leveraged and mistook hope for a business strategy.
BMW or Mercedes or VAG would copy Mclaren’s technology to their advantage.
 

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Back in the late 90s I had just joined a large private equity fund that was looking at buying Lamborghini. I was not involved in the deal but went to the lead investment guy on the deal and, because of my love for the brand, despite the discounts I would get, all the cheap parts and access, I told him it would be best if a large automaker bought them because they needed more than any PE group could provide. He told me it wasn't like an engineering problem, but PE was to just to buy low, make some improvements and sell for much more. We did not buy it and eventually Volkswagen did and they have been delivering much better cars ever since (but not as good as McLaren).

So selling to a large autogroup might help the brand and the products. Or kill it (like Lancia and to some extent Maserati).
 

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Hello
The Bank of Bahrain will help Mclaren financially.
Still, 1,200 fewer employees is a big blow. What do you think about the situation but especially about the development of new models, which will surely be postponed. Is it better for our 720s which will lose less value, less quickly?
 

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This current loan is for 150M pounds. They were initially looking for 280 to get them into 2021. Good start.................

Wouldn't be surprised if there was a delay in production due to nervous suppliers wanting to be paid sooner than the current 60 day accounts.

It's a double edged sword as to the value of existing cars. If less are produced, that would help but if ongoing support/warranty protection is at risk, thats bad.

I'm close to ordering a 765 but won't trade my 720 until I'm confident the 765 will arrive in a reasonable time.
 

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This current loan is for 150M pounds. They were initially looking for 280 to get them into 2021. Good start.................

Wouldn't be surprised if there was a delay in production due to nervous suppliers wanting to be paid sooner than the current 60 day accounts.

It's a double edged sword as to the value of existing cars. If less are produced, that would help but if ongoing support/warranty protection is at risk, thats bad.

I'm close to ordering a 765 but won't trade my 720 until I'm confident the 765 will arrive in a reasonable time.
765 :love:
 

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This current loan is for 150M pounds. They were initially looking for 280 to get them into 2021. Good start.................

Wouldn't be surprised if there was a delay in production due to nervous suppliers wanting to be paid sooner than the current 60 day accounts.

It's a double edged sword as to the value of existing cars. If less are produced, that would help but if ongoing support/warranty protection is at risk, thats bad.

I'm close to ordering a 765 but won't trade my 720 until I'm confident the 765 will arrive in a reasonable time.
lets not forget that its also bad for existing cars with the perception that Mac is becoming insolvent... so not just warranty concerns but perception of the viability of the company cant be good for our 720s values... good news is yes, maybe they back away from churning so many models so quickly...

In all honesty, love what the brand stands for and this is my 4th Mac but they run the company like a bunch of college grads in a basement... blunder after blunder... i am praying they get taken out by BMW or MB ... Lambo being bought did well for the brand and it hasnt lost its mystique ... luckily the replacement for 720 isn’t expected to hit grounds until 2023 end or even 2024 so they have time to sort out their issues... i hope someone like BMW and MB steps up... maybe even Apple!

mistake after mistakes!

1- mp4c/650
2- too much supply of 675lt
3- followed by too quick of a release of 675 spider
4- 570GT and then another GT model... are you kidding!
5- launch of 720s with the worse color choice!
6- too quick of a 720s spider release
7- elva... lowering initial volumes figures because of a lack of demand ... couldnt they spend this money elsewhere???
8- pushing out 765 too quick and in very challenging and oversupplied times... they should wait on 765... after pandemic subsides... anyone can still get one (i just got a call) and thats not good for scarcity value for a limited production car
9- no after market support for 3rd party repair shops! this is a backbreaker!
10- quality control issues ongoing.
11 - subpar customer support... i cant believe the customer service process when i got my G63amg... very professional.

and list can go on. sorry to rant... i am a big supporter but Mac needs big boys to step up... mac has the cars and tech, it just needs leadership and direction!!!!
 

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lets not forget that its also bad for existing cars with the perception that Mac is becoming insolvent... so not just warranty concerns but perception of the viability of the company cant be good for our 720s values... good news is yes, maybe they back away from churning so many models so quickly...

In all honesty, love what the brand stands for and this is my 4th Mac but they run the company like a bunch of college grads in a basement... blunder after blunder... i am praying they get taken out by BMW or MB ... Lambo being bought did well for the brand and it hasnt lost its mystique ... luckily the replacement for 720 isn’t expected to hit grounds until 2023 end or even 2024 so they have time to sort out their issues... i hope someone like BMW and MB steps up... maybe even Apple!

mistake after mistakes!

1- mp4c/650
2- too much supply of 675lt
3- followed by too quick of a release of 675 spider
4- 570GT and then another GT model... are you kidding!
5- launch of 720s with the worse color choice!
6- too quick of a 720s spider release
7- elva... lowering initial volumes figures because of a lack of demand ... couldnt they spend this money elsewhere???
8- pushing out 765 too quick and in very challenging and oversupplied times... they should wait on 765... after pandemic subsides... anyone can still get one (i just got a call) and thats not good for scarcity value for a limited production car
9- no after market support for 3rd party repair shops! this is a backbreaker!
10- quality control issues ongoing.
11 - subpar customer support... i cant believe the customer service process when i got my G63amg... very professional.

and list can go on. sorry to rant... i am a big supporter but Mac needs big boys to step up... mac has the cars and tech, it just needs leadership and direction!!!!
You’re right. Mac is run by a bunch of amateurs. We will all celebrate if and when they finally get some adult supervision. Hope it’s BMW or Mercedes Benz.
 

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You’re right. Mac is run by a bunch of amateurs. We will all celebrate if and when they finally get some adult supervision. Hope it’s BMW or Mercedes Benz.
Problem is you may not get the ground breaking performance which Macs offer as the brand would likely have to fit into the hierarchy of the parent company's existing high end car brand structure.
 

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lets not forget that its also bad for existing cars with the perception that Mac is becoming insolvent... so not just warranty concerns but perception of the viability of the company cant be good for our 720s values... good news is yes, maybe they back away from churning so many models so quickly...

In all honesty, love what the brand stands for and this is my 4th Mac but they run the company like a bunch of college grads in a basement... blunder after blunder... i am praying they get taken out by BMW or MB ... Lambo being bought did well for the brand and it hasnt lost its mystique ... luckily the replacement for 720 isn’t expected to hit grounds until 2023 end or even 2024 so they have time to sort out their issues... i hope someone like BMW and MB steps up... maybe even Apple!

mistake after mistakes!

1- mp4c/650
2- too much supply of 675lt
3- followed by too quick of a release of 675 spider
4- 570GT and then another GT model... are you kidding!
5- launch of 720s with the worse color choice!
6- too quick of a 720s spider release
7- elva... lowering initial volumes figures because of a lack of demand ... couldnt they spend this money elsewhere???
8- pushing out 765 too quick and in very challenging and oversupplied times... they should wait on 765... after pandemic subsides... anyone can still get one (i just got a call) and thats not good for scarcity value for a limited production car
9- no after market support for 3rd party repair shops! this is a backbreaker!
10- quality control issues ongoing.
11 - subpar customer support... i cant believe the customer service process when i got my G63amg... very professional.

and list can go on. sorry to rant... i am a big supporter but Mac needs big boys to step up... mac has the cars and tech, it just needs leadership and direction!!!!
...and you forgot about the 600LT which is the best car i have ever driven in the line up. Not limited numbers, just kept churning them out for a limited time frame which killed exclusivity.

I have a allocation for the 765 but i just don't know what to do at the moment. If they offer the 600LT deals on the 765, i will be able to get a brand new car for 10k down, 2k per month in 18 months time. 🤪

I hope they sort themselves out.
 

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Problem is you may not get the ground breaking performance which Macs offer as the brand would likely have to fit into the hierarchy of the parent company's existing high end car brand structure.
True. I don’t mean to sound selfish but I’d rather have a professional management team like at BMW or Mercedes providing after market support for my current 720s than worry about what might happen to some unspecified future Mac model.
 

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...and you forgot about the 600LT which is the best car i have ever driven in the line up. Not limited numbers, just kept churning them out for a limited time frame which killed exclusivity.

I have a allocation for the 765 but i just don't know what to do at the moment. If they offer the 600LT deals on the 765, i will be able to get a brand new car for 10k down, 2k per month in 18 months time.

I hope they sort themselves out.
its odd to see lenders not putting on a tighter grip... clearly there are issues.
 

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Does any of you know the conditions of the declined loan which was offered to McLaren by the Credit brokers with whom McLaren is in court right now ? I only read the conditions were unacceptable (I guess 10% plus interest rate or sth. ? ) ...
 
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