[Boxer]

Had a discussion with one of the guys who is very familiar with the P1 development. Despite all the internet rumors that the P1 engine is just a souped up version of the 12C unit, 90% is new and unique to the P1. It is just a bit of a confusing coincidence that it happens to share the same displacement of 3.8 liters.

 

[Mikeyb]

I got the same chat with them boxer, perhaps with the same guy I guess. I did question why they didn just change the displacement to a small degree and I got the scientific answer of optimum capacity etc etc. even if the had increased capacity the architecture was going to be v8 so they'd have got 'its just a bored/stroked 12c' so no win but I guess it's an admission that its a weak marketing point for them in some eyes

 

[Boxer]

I got the same chat with them boxer, perhaps with the same guy I guess. I did question why they didn just change the displacement to a small degree and I got the scientific answer of optimum capacity etc etc. even if the had increased capacity the architecture was going to be v8 so they'd have got 'its just a bored/stroked 12c' so no win but I guess it's an admission that its a weak marketing point for them in some eyes

They are brilliant engineers and designers but I do get the impression that the marketing guys don't have much input into some of the development plans. On the engine, making it a 4 liter would have just made life a lot easier.

 

[Wtdoom]

I feel for mac in this respect , the laf engine is traceable back to the enzo . These things are modified , it's no big deal .
The suspension is also sometimes criticised , that's like criticising a laf or f1 for having springs and dampers , after all the principle is the same on a ford focus .
I have my criticisms of mclaren , like I have with all manufacturers but fair is fair eh?

 

[extremeride22]

I hope this isn't another one of your rumors Boxer LOL. Cheers....??

 

[Mikeyb]

Agree, and whilst it frustrates me I also quite like it as I know there's no compromise for what people might think should be done, for 'cosmetic' reasons.

 

[andy c]

I hope this isn't another one of your rumors Boxer LOL. Cheers....����

All true Ken,but you knew that anyway

 

[andy c]

Agree, and whilst it frustrates me I also quite like it as I know there's no compromise for what people might think should be done, for 'cosmetic' reasons.

Yes,i think we are all of the opinion of Doom,good thing is their won;t be handbags at dawn with this car,it will be too far ahead of the competition when it hits the track,and too comfortable getting there,might have a bit of emotion thrown it too .

 

[Wtdoom]

Yes,i think we are all of the opinion of Doom,good thing is their won;t be handbags at dawn with this car,it will be too far ahead of the competition when it hits the track,and too comfortable getting there,might have a bit of emotion thrown it too .

I think a lot of us are guilty of writing off the laf and even the 918 .
I am sure that each car will be fastest on the track that suits the driving characteristics of the said vehicle . I think the companies involved are too good and the cars too important for one car to dominate all others on all tracks , that really will be a feat I think impossible .

 

[ergoproxy]

So is it or isn't it the same "platform" as the 12C? This could only mean same or different different tub. So who cares but the picayune press and haters? I don't have a deposit on a P1 but I do for the next 12C iteration. Hoping for some trickle down tech.

Apparently there was a marketing need but not an engineering need for some radical departure....like a central driver position...

 

[andy c]

So is it or isn't it the same "platform" as the 12C? This could only mean same or different different tub. So who cares but the picayune press and haters? I don't have a deposit on a P1 but I do for the next 12C iteration. Hoping for some trickle down tech.

Apparently there was a marketing need but not an engineering need for some radical departure....like a central driver position...

Similar to look at,but with an integrated cage and different CF components,the process is the same but I don't think they used the same mould as the cage is not just tacked on.

 

[andy c]

I think a lot of us are guilty of writing off the laf and even the 918 .
I am sure that each car will be fastest on the track that suits the driving characteristics of the said vehicle . I think the companies involved are too good and the cars too important for one car to dominate all others on all tracks , that really will be a feat I think impossible .

I take your point,i suppose a low downforce track ,where the need to get out of tight corners quickly would suit the 918 better than the others.Saying that it's obvious that I don:t want Porsche to fail in anyway and its likely to be the most usable in the long term.

 

[ZachF]

Had a discussion with one of the guys who is very familiar with the P1 development. Despite all the internet rumors that the P1 engine is just a souped up version of the 12C unit, 90% is new and unique to the P1. It is just a bit of a confusing coincidence that it happens to share the same displacement of 3.8 liters.

90% of the parts are new, but that does not mean it's a new engine. A lot of the parts are probably lighter-weight versions of the parts on the 12c. The block is different to incorporate the electric motor. It likely has different profile cams, larger turbos, a beefed up crankshaft, probably different, lighter weight & stronger con-rods and pistons, a more powerful coolant pump and larger radiators & intercoolers, etc, etc... when you add it up a lot of the parts are different but it's not a new engine by a long shot.

 

[Boxer]

90% of the parts are new, but that does not mean it's a new engine. A lot of the parts are probably lighter-weight versions of the parts on the 12c. The block is different to incorporate the electric motor. It likely has different profile cams, larger turbos, a beefed up crankshaft, probably different, lighter weight & stronger con-rods and pistons, a more powerful coolant pump and larger radiators & intercoolers, etc, etc... when you add it up a lot of the parts are different but it's not a new engine by a long shot.

What then is the tipping point to qualify as being a "different" engine?

 

[M444TTB]

'Architecture' is probably the correct answer but a different block is, in reality, enough to qualify I reckon.

 

[widowmaker911]

They are brilliant engineers and designers but I do get the impression that the marketing guys don't have much input into some of the development plans. On the engine, making it a 4 liter would have just made life a lot easier.

Add DFI to that 4.0L too

 

[widowmaker911]

Had a discussion with one of the guys who is very familiar with the P1 development. Despite all the internet rumors that the P1 engine is just a souped up version of the 12C unit, 90% is new and unique to the P1. It is just a bit of a confusing coincidence that it happens to share the same displacement of 3.8 liters.

Did the architecture of the V8 change........BS same engine just tuned with hybrid added!
Nothing ground breaking........now the Jag, that would have been amazing/ground breaking. P1=12C (tuned), why do you think they can trickle the power down to the next 12C upgrade to possibly 650hp. SAME

 

[widowmaker911]

Similar to look at,but with an integrated cage and different CF components,the process is the same but I don't think they used the same mould as the cage is not just tacked on.

Bet that cage is bonded......tub same dimensions, reason for exactly the same interior layout as the 12C. business model (parts sharing) makes perfect sense, as for a HALO car, NOT!

 

[widowmaker911]

90% of the parts are new, but that does not mean it's a new engine. A lot of the parts are probably lighter-weight versions of the parts on the 12c. The block is different to incorporate the electric motor. It likely has different profile cams, larger turbos, a beefed up crankshaft, probably different, lighter weight & stronger con-rods and pistons, a more powerful coolant pump and larger radiators & intercoolers, etc, etc... when you add it up a lot of the parts are different but it's not a new engine by a long shot.

GOT THAT RIGHT

 

[widowmaker911]

What then is the tipping point to qualify as being a "different" engine?

C-X75..........the JAG also sounds way better. P1=12C (louder) regarding sound