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looks like TAG called it..........light option with corsa @ 1:12.9 IS [email protected]#KIN BONKERS!!!!!!
Laptimes Dunsfold "Topgear track" MP4-12C
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Uhh, you are missing the circularity there. The jalopnik piece is not a confirmation. Click on the link to see where it leads.
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well called Krzys
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ooooops sorry mates
.........jalopnik quoted TAG......WTF!!.....who does that.....still hoping it's trueDear sir!
Cheers!
To say it's "bonkers" it's a bit premature! The Aventador is almost said to be Bugatti performance around Dunsfold ie 1min 16.8 seconds! The Ferrari 458 Scuderia is surely 2 seconds at least faster than the standard car! This years Super Sports tires from Michelen is 1.5 seconds faster than 2010 years tires according to the company! So that would mean that a Ferrari 458 Italia would lap the Dunsfold track in 1min 17.5 seconds instead of 1min 19.1 seconds! And remember the McLaren Mp4-12C has a genius suspension technology combined with the stiff carbon mono cell chassi! Personally i don't doubt the person at McLaren London who said that a showroom MP4-12C would be 2 seconds faster than the Veyron Supersport! The "MAC" is 80 kg lighter than the "Fezza" and it seems to have the latest tire technology aswell so don't be suprised if the "MAC" is that fast! And by the way when Ferrari shows there Scuderia then McLaren shows there GT and GTR versions! Then probably the name 12C could mean 1min 12 seconds;-) Let's hope so
Cheers!
Corsa tires have been around for many many years (around 5-7 I think) so they are not really new technology that give such a leap in performance. The sporty P cars come with either Corsa or MPC (which are a bit quicker on dry) and the sport ferrari cars come with either corsa or the new Michelin Supersports that are probably a little be slower than the corsas.. (optimized new design for a non R compound like the others) but not by more than a few .10s maybe. So tires is not the deciding factor here.
If the 12c is anywhere near the times mentioned above then it means that the traction out of corners must be greatly improved vs competition and also that the power announced may be a bit conservative. To be honest the car I drove felt stronger than the power announced but one cant be sure because of gearing and that super quick gearbox.
If the 12c is anywhere near the times mentioned above then it means that the traction out of corners must be greatly improved vs competition and also that the power announced may be a bit conservative. To be honest the car I drove felt stronger than the power announced but one cant be sure because of gearing and that super quick gearbox.
150 kg lighter.. well according to mclaren it's 80 kg. 150 well thats even better then. the topgear ferrari 458 was shoded with michelin 2009-10 tires. 2011 supersport tires according to michelin is 1.5 seconds a lapfaster and 10% better durability. 2011 ferrari 458:s are on the standard list since it's simply is a better tire than the model before.
http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives...-drives/Michelin-Supersport-2010-tyre-review/
facts before fictions
facts before fictions
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240 Posts
TAG's post on here is now spreading round the internet!
http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/mclaren-mp4-12cfastest-at-the-top-gear-track-ar109732.html
http://www.teamspeed.com/forums/sup...aren-mp4-12c-smashes-top-gear-lap-record.html
http://www.fastestlaps.com/cars/mclaren_mp4-12c.html
http://www.r8talk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=72897#post72897
http://allcarsreview.com/2011/05/16/mclaren-mp4-12c-fastest-at-the-top-gear-track/
http://theblogofcars.com/2011/05/mc...laps-top-gear-dunsfold-test-track-in-114-118/
http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/mclaren-mp4-12cfastest-at-the-top-gear-track-ar109732.html
http://www.teamspeed.com/forums/sup...aren-mp4-12c-smashes-top-gear-lap-record.html
http://www.fastestlaps.com/cars/mclaren_mp4-12c.html
http://www.r8talk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=72897#post72897
http://allcarsreview.com/2011/05/16/mclaren-mp4-12c-fastest-at-the-top-gear-track/
http://theblogofcars.com/2011/05/mc...laps-top-gear-dunsfold-test-track-in-114-118/
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Oh dear !! would be nice to hear a comment from the dealer,as i know they look at this site
If we compare against michelin pilot 2 (a very average tire to put it diplomatically) then yes the supersports should be worth quite a bit. But is that what they sell the 458 with really? I doubt it..http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives...-drives/Michelin-Supersport-2010-tyre-review/
facts before fictions
Compared to R rated tires (MPC, Corsas etc) the supersports will not be faster. Maybe more all around but not faster.
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My first reaction to these rumoured TG lap times is "no chance!", however I have to remind myself that McLaren has approached the performance spec of this car with Formula One development and testing methodology. By this I mean that if they used the TG circuit as their official test track and were aiming to optimize a lap time specifically for that course, then perhaps we may be foolish to doubt this information.
For example, everything, from tire compound to ESC calibration, gear ratios, throttle mappings, suspension tuning and braking balance may have been developed specifically to achieve the lowest lap time - as if they were bringing a racecar to a grand-prix weekend. In that light, I could see an argument for lap times as rosy as these. Also, whereas TG typically has a single day or morning to set a time with a car, no matter the conditions, presumably McLaren has had many, many test days. Surely, at least one of those test days was in the most ideal conditions (high grip, high horsepower) and that can easily make a significant difference.
However, I'm not sure why the info would directly contradict what Chris Goodwin is letting on, as his "everything with a roof and doors" statement seemed pretty conclusive to me.
One thing is for sure - it's definitely not hard to spread a rumour like wildfire on the internet these days... you'll forever now have a hard time convincing a lot of people that the 12C doesn't do the TG track in 1 min 14.
For example, everything, from tire compound to ESC calibration, gear ratios, throttle mappings, suspension tuning and braking balance may have been developed specifically to achieve the lowest lap time - as if they were bringing a racecar to a grand-prix weekend. In that light, I could see an argument for lap times as rosy as these. Also, whereas TG typically has a single day or morning to set a time with a car, no matter the conditions, presumably McLaren has had many, many test days. Surely, at least one of those test days was in the most ideal conditions (high grip, high horsepower) and that can easily make a significant difference.
However, I'm not sure why the info would directly contradict what Chris Goodwin is letting on, as his "everything with a roof and doors" statement seemed pretty conclusive to me.
One thing is for sure - it's definitely not hard to spread a rumour like wildfire on the internet these days... you'll forever now have a hard time convincing a lot of people that the 12C doesn't do the TG track in 1 min 14.
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Amazing how things spread on the Internet. Looks like topspeed.com needs to do a better job of giving TAG the credit, no mention of source, then allcarsreview quotes topspeed as the origin of the news. Really funny to see all the comments on the other forums/blogs. If the 1:14 holds true... wow.
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Another thing that puzzles me is the 3 decimal precision on the lap times. That seems a little fussy, even for McLaren!
No offense, TAG, but the whole thing smells a little. However, I will gladly eat those words.
No offense, TAG, but the whole thing smells a little. However, I will gladly eat those words.
Lets not forget that AndyC and myself and probably other posters on this site have actually (and fortunatly) sat in the 12C and gone round the TG track in approximately 1:24, mine from a rolling start and driven by McLaren racing/test drivers.
And lets put it mildly, it was f***ing quick.
To think that it could go 8 or even 10 seconds quicker, is very questionable, but given perfect tyres and brakes and set up specifically, then yes something near 1:16 may be achievable.
Lets put it another way and be in the real world, who on this forum could achieve anything close to 1:24, very few, if any, and most of us would struggle to get near 1:30.
That’s not a criticism of the 12C, but an illustration of the difference between driving ability and the ability of the cars we drive.
And lets put it mildly, it was f***ing quick.
To think that it could go 8 or even 10 seconds quicker, is very questionable, but given perfect tyres and brakes and set up specifically, then yes something near 1:16 may be achievable.
Lets put it another way and be in the real world, who on this forum could achieve anything close to 1:24, very few, if any, and most of us would struggle to get near 1:30.
That’s not a criticism of the 12C, but an illustration of the difference between driving ability and the ability of the cars we drive.
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Right, so if the rumor turns out to be a load, what recourse do we have? Shall we boycott that dealer and boo TAG off the forum?? Who will pay for our torment?!
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