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Discussion Starter #1
Out tomorrow and to my biggest surprise, the title says it looses against the 458 Italia (maybe once again they are going to complain about the lack of soul... to perfect). Can't wait to read the article.
Table of contents here.
 

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Ok, I still can't get the payment through, but I read the sample on autocar page. So far, the complaint is about sound and lack of Ferrari histrionics and wonderful ride. One big disappointment: weight: 1465kg/3223lb.
 

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Ok, I read the article and despite the title it is NOT a test of the cars at all. There are no numbers from the track and the ones shown are simply from press releases. They mention that on the track at really big speed it is much faster but offer no times and then comment that it does not really matter, since Ferrari is a better supercar (meaning mainly louder and sounding better). I am sorry it's a total BS article. The comparisons to the other cars are just summary of the other cars' stats with some random comments. In a word: garbage.
 

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What gets me in the review is when they talk about the amazing cornering speeds the car can get and that nothing can touch it, but then make the most idiotic comment that Italia is still close since the difference in time laps will be counted in one digit percentages: in other words, say 5-7 sec difference is "small" by their argument and lest I forget ..."Italia is not a toy".

This is also coupled with another argument that, you know, the difference of 0-60 of .2 sec is just small. I am sorry it starts to look to me like an agenda is involved when lots of misleading and irrelevant arguments are being made. Hey, if somebody really needs the noise and super-fast steering in their supercar experience and lap times don't matter, then I understand that. No problem with that, but if your car is 5 secs behind on a track, it is a toy.
 

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Ok, I still can't get the payment through, but I read the sample on autocar page. So far, the complaint is about sound and lack of Ferrari histrionics and wonderful ride. One big disappointment: weight: 1465kg/3223lb.
1465kg for the 12C??
 

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Not a good start at all..
ditto.....NOT GOOD:(..........they were suppose to hit it outta the ball park.........it should have been so good that looks and sounds should not have mattered.........Ron Dennis promised the WORLD........REALLY:confused:......very disappointing esp curb weight @ over 3200lbs:eek:........RS 4.0 is under 3000lbs (curb):eek:.........gonna have to rethink my decision:(.........thank god i DID NOT place a deposit;)..........goona wait for the 'LIGHT' version or look elsewhere........Porsche maybe with new mid-engine prospect or next gen lambo gallardo:rolleyes:.........i can't get pass the headlights of the italia (FUGLY)
 

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ditto.....NOT GOOD:(..........they were suppose to hit it outta the ball park.........it should have been so good that looks and sounds should not have mattered.........Ron Dennis promised the WORLD........REALLY:confused:......very disappointing esp curb weight @ over 3200lbs:eek:........RS 4.0 is under 3000lbs (curb):eek:.........gonna have to rethink my decision:(.........thank god i DID NOT place a deposit;)..........goona wait for the 'LIGHT' version or look elsewhere........Porsche maybe with new mid-engine prospect or new lambo gallardo:rolleyes:.........i can't get pass the headlights of the italia (FUGLY)
I am sorry, but I do not entirely get your reaction. Weight? Agreed. Disturbingly high. BUT... if the criteria are sound/throttle response and fast steering rack,then Mc12 is guaranteed to lose every time. We knew that from the original batch of reviews. Nothing new here.

Especially, when somobedy then goes on and argue that a veritable gulf in performance is just micro-difference.

However, if the weight of the US cars comes within a sniff of 3300 lbs, I am asking for my deposit back, too.
 

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I am sorry, but I do not entirely get your reaction. Weight? Agreed. Disturbingly high. BUT... if the criteria are sound/throttle response and fast steering rack,then Mc12 is guaranteed to lose every time. We knew that from the original batch of reviews. Nothing new here.

Especially, when somobedy then goes on and argue that a veritable gulf in performance is just micro-difference.

However, if the weight of the US cars comes within a sniff of 3300 lbs, I am asking for my deposit back, too.
i luv'd the 12C........bought into all the hype........i liked the looks esp the 'lambo' doors and the interior optioned correctly looked better than the italia IMO.......would have bought it in a heartbeat esp in McLaren Orange;).........i didnt care about the sound (i have a 997tt:rolleyes:) i think with the Inconel exhaust option it would sound just right........but if weight comes in near 3300lbs and the track times don't pan out .........gonna have to go back to my childhood dream..........PORSCHE;)........3300lbs (curb) is a far cry form 1300kg (dry)!!!!
 

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i luv'd the 12C........bought into all the hype........i liked the looks esp the 'lambo' doors and the interior optioned correctly looked better than the italia IMO.......would have bought it in a heartbeat esp in McLaren Orange;).........i didnt care about the sound (i have a 997tt:rolleyes:) i think with the Inconel exhaust option it would sound just right........but if weight comes in near 3300lbs and the track times don't pan out .........gonna have to go back to my childhood dream..........PORSCHE;)........3300lbs (curb) is a far cry form 1300kg (dry)!!!!
The weight is potentially a big problem for me, too. However, the article suggests that the crazy lap times will pan out. It just calls a difference of several seconds on a track a micro difference. Which is a pretty stunning piece of stupidity from autocar of all places. Those people should know better.

The car is around 100 lbs too heavy. Obviously, depending on options, you can get there, but it is way too much for a mag tester.

The biggest disappointment here is Autocar: instead of publishing a test of two cars, they put out a fluff piece about one guy's love for Italia's sound. Hey, I love it , too. Just the lardy rest gets in the way.
 

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The weight is potentially a big problem for me, too. However, the article suggests that the crazy lap times will pan out. It just calls a difference of several seconds on a track a micro difference. Which is a pretty stunning piece of stupidity from autocar of all places. Those people should know better.

The car is around 100 lbs too heavy. Obviously, depending on options, you can get there, but it is way too much for a mag tester.

The biggest disappointment here is Autocar: instead of publishing a test of two cars, they put out a fluff piece about one guy's love for Italia's sound. Hey, I love it , too. Just the lardy rest gets in the way.
........desparately hoping other comparo test shed a different light.......on holding pattern for now.........gonna hold out for the road version of GT3 racer or convertible.......if italia sweeps comparo test........gonna definitely look elsewhere:(..........what i don't get is Steve Sutcliffe (Autocar) on his review gave the nod to the 12C instead of 458?
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Disappointing indeed... it's unfortunately not the first comparo in Autocar to be disappointing.The full tests are usually much better, I hope the MP4-12C will go through it and be lapped.
Also out today, Auto Express with another comparo against the Italia (round 2 ;) ). Cannot read it from this PC, I cannot install the latest reader for Zinio, will look at it tonight.
 

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Irritated by Autocar

Only in England !!!

In the 12C, we have a car that is at the cutting edge of technology and in every tangible performance term, eclipses what is otherwise available from the similar price bracket competition (by however a minor degree). The Autocar review is one man's subjective view and he seems to suggest that it is not necessarily the same view of what another person might conclude.

What is hugely disappointing therefore is Autocar's decision to splash "Ferrari beats McLaren" on its cover when that is not the whole story and seems to me, in what is a typical tabloid-esque style, to build up and knock down anything British.

Can anyone imagine an Italian Publication stating, in similar shock headline terms, that the McLaren were superior to a home grown product, even were that the true case ?
 
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