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Point being they are feeling the pressure from McLaren. There is no way my local F dealer would be soliciting me, otherwise, for this speciale version (my dealer is THE dealer that was blogged about, that historically does not give a ---- about anybody but its list of serial buyers).

Many here seem to view the past 3 years of McLaren as a series of mistakes. Which is why this forum has become a miserable, boring place to visit (McDc's recent Ring drive excepted). Personally, I see a series of master strokes to get a brand new supercar company off the ground in perhaps the worst economic climate ever to do so. Maybe I'm just an optimist. Some things you can plan for, some you just have to react to. This 458 is not special to me and I agree with others will prob be less special than the scud or CS, despite the heaps of praise on the way from nearly out of work auto journalists. Now, a 12C speciale with 640 hp, 150lbs less, carbon tub and rev2 of PCC, etc...? You really don't think McLaren is well positioned? It wasn't luck, but smart decisions made by Ron and his engineers many moons ago. I'm not interested in what dipshit journalists think. I'm interested in getting the best supercar in the world for the money. The F dealer fellow will not get a response from me to get in line for this 458.
Anyone spending 200 - 300k and not considering a Mclaren IMO doean't deserve one.

All I would like is another tire option - after installing RE-11a's on my 16M the Pirelli don't cut it.

Ferrari IMO is lowering the bar with the Speciale - when the 458 was introduced I bought a 16M and the other day a 360 Challenge car to have a lil fun.

Regardless - I hope this place perks with car guys vs deteriorates with whining.

What happened to the days where male car owners refused to ask for directions because they didn't mind getting lost and driving their cars more than less.

Who the F*** wants to get to a place on time vs leaving late getting lost and driving fast - it's a lot more fun than arriving on time and saying my navi got me here on time ... weak sauce as Mclaren owners and enthusiasts deserve better.

I assume when an owner is approached they never - lower their shoulders bend their wrist and softly announce my navi and blue tooth isn't functioning correctly.
 

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Point being they are feeling the pressure from McLaren. There is no way my local F dealer would be soliciting me, otherwise, for this speciale version (my dealer is THE dealer that was blogged about, that historically does not give a ---- about anybody but its list of serial buyers).

Many here seem to view the past 3 years of McLaren as a series of mistakes. Which is why this forum has become a miserable, boring place to visit (McDc's recent Ring drive excepted). Personally, I see a series of master strokes to get a brand new supercar company off the ground in perhaps the worst economic climate ever to do so. Maybe I'm just an optimist. Some things you can plan for, some you just have to react to. This 458 is not special to me and I agree with others will prob be less special than the scud or CS, despite the heaps of praise on the way from nearly out of work auto journalists. Now, a 12C speciale with 640 hp, 150lbs less, carbon tub and rev2 of PCC, etc...? You really don't think McLaren is well positioned? It wasn't luck, but smart decisions made by Ron and his engineers many moons ago. I'm not interested in what dipshit journalists think. I'm interested in getting the best supercar in the world for the money. The F dealer fellow will not get a response from me to get in line for this 458.
Well, you are not trying to suggest that Mclaren have not actually made plenty of mistakes in the past 3 years...? For a company that is famously supposed to be obssessive to the last detail, there has been a rather large disjoint between that perception and the actual reality.

As far as being well positioned, these special editions are not really going to impact the bottom line significantly given the low production numbers. Sure Mclaren can produce a gt3 version that is faster/lighter/more powerful on paper and if engaging in this pointless one upmanship of various figures is their objective then yes I accept the 12c is better positioned.

However the 12c has always had that advantage over the 458 anyway and yet a significant majority of people have preferred the 458 for varying reasons. And I somewhat fail to see how one can state so easily that the speciale is considered less er, special compared to the standard car than the CS to the 360 or Scud to 430. It is simply following the template of a a lighter weight/more powerful/stripped down car that the previous models had started. I repeat, the 458 speciale will almost certainly be a bloody good car to drive if they can make a similar step up from the 458 as the scud did from the 430 and there is no reason to suggest that it cannot.

Mclaren have done a lot of good things, I like my car rather a lot as it so happens but does not mean I think Mclaren/Ron Dennis are infallible either.
 

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Well, you are not trying to suggest that Mclaren have not actually made plenty of mistakes in the past 3 years...? For a company that is famously supposed to be obssessive to the last detail, there has been a rather large disjoint between that perception and the actual reality.

As far as being well positioned, these special editions are not really going to impact the bottom line significantly given the low production numbers. Sure Mclaren can produce a gt3 version that is faster/lighter/more powerful on paper and if engaging in this pointless one upmanship of various figures is their objective then yes I accept the 12c is better positioned.

However the 12c has always had that advantage over the 458 anyway and yet a significant majority of people have preferred the 458 for varying reasons. And I somewhat fail to see how one can state so easily that the speciale is considered less er, special compared to the standard car than the CS to the 360 or Scud to 430. It is simply following the template of a a lighter weight/more powerful/stripped down car that the previous models had started. I repeat, the 458 speciale will almost certainly be a bloody good car to drive if they can make a similar step up from the 458 as the scud did from the 430 and there is no reason to suggest that it cannot.

Mclaren have done a lot of good things, I like my car rather a lot as it so happens but does not mean I think Mclaren/Ron Dennis are infallible either.
Perspective is key.

The Aventador can't hold a transmission and all the recalls by Ferrari were of serious nature.

Ferrari or anyone else has never added hp and performance upgrades let alone willing to fly a tech to my home for service.

At the end of the day - we all want to go faster but safety is job 1.

That cf cockpit air brake brake steer are all key vs some passenger knee bumpers.

In the car business - you lead follow or get out. To this day no one has kept up with Mclaren where it counts.
 

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Well, you are not trying to suggest that Mclaren have not actually made plenty of mistakes in the past 3 years...? For a company that is famously supposed to be obssessive to the last detail, there has been a rather large disjoint between that perception and the actual reality.

As far as being well positioned, these special editions are not really going to impact the bottom line significantly given the low production numbers. Sure Mclaren can produce a gt3 version that is faster/lighter/more powerful on paper and if engaging in this pointless one upmanship of various figures is their objective then yes I accept the 12c is better positioned.

However the 12c has always had that advantage over the 458 anyway and yet a significant majority of people have preferred the 458 for varying reasons. And I somewhat fail to see how one can state so easily that the speciale is considered less er, special compared to the standard car than the CS to the 360 or Scud to 430. It is simply following the template of a a lighter weight/more powerful/stripped down car that the previous models had started. I repeat, the 458 speciale will almost certainly be a bloody good car to drive if they can make a similar step up from the 458 as the scud did from the 430 and there is no reason to suggest that it cannot.

Mclaren have done a lot of good things, I like my car rather a lot as it so happens but does not mean I think Mclaren/Ron Dennis are infallible either.
Infallible is your word, not mine. What I am saying is so many armchair tycoons here think they could have done better than Ron and his team under the circumstances, when I can guarantee you that not one of us could have, on the aggregate. It's a massive achievement that they have accomplished. Sometimes it feels like many would rather they had assumed a rank and file slot alongside Aston, who has done sweet f--- all lately, instead of taking on the best of the best in Maranello. The fact that they are even in position to challenge LaFerrari and now speciale, if they choose to, with higher performing products, is astounding. You'd think it was easy and trivial to do that, by the attitudes around here.
 

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Perspective is key.

The Aventador can't hold a transmission and all the recalls by Ferrari were of serious nature.
Exactly. In many respects, McLaren has already leapfrogged Lambo, Aston, and others after only two(!) models. Browse the Ferrari forums right now you'll find 458 owners with serious electrical issues where the system needs rebooting and if they leave the car in their garage off the charger, it goes completely dead. Or the FF which has the instrument cluster/RPM counter go blank, completely at random while driving.

And people want Ron & McLaren to move Heaven and Earth already, while they are perfectly fine accepting garbage from the incumbents.

This forum lacks perspective in a major way and also could benefit from some slightly more active moderation. Free speech is important, but I am coming here less and less because I am busy and when I get a minute to log on, 90% of the time I see the dumbest comments imaginable from certain users about how McLaren is a f--- up.
 

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My 2012 V12 Vantage trans my replaced under 1k miles... I don't consider Aston a comp to Ferrari, Lambo or McLaren - way to different of a mission if you will. Price points and presence, I guess they are about the same. Kind of like the comparison of Bentley to a 599.... I guess they are the same type of car (GT) but on completely different ends of the spectrum. I will say the Aston interior is far ahead of the McLaren, conversely the performance of the 12c is far ahead of the Aston. The Aston infotainment system my work 100% of the time and have more features however if I want to select a playlist on the ipod I need to pull over and dedicate 3 minutes or more to go thru the stupid menu system that Aston has been using for the last 10+ years. It's all low hanging fruit for journalists and people in general who by nature are inherently resistant to change.

McLaren is the new (to production street cars) kid on the block and the last think any of the other camps want to see is the new kid upset the delicate balance between Ferrari & Lambo....I hate to throw Porsche into the equation, but they try really hard. The 12c obliterates them on every performance front they can dream up, so what's left....The IRIS..... True they are throwing stones in a glass house but until the mass media (unfortunately) reveres the car the simple fact that it will outperform the competition then folks will not buy it because it's cool, but less cool than the 458 or whatever because 9 out of 10 journalists say so. I think McLaren is simply having to go thru the growing pains of being the newcomer in a well established marketplace. Racing history gives them credibility, the F1 proved they could do it, the 12c's price allows many more to become critics than the F1. Many journalists were just in the past few years even getting an opportunity to review/drive the F1 - the 12c is available to darn near everyone, thus every naysayer who is loyal to one brand or another.

It will be our little secret, those who know - the rest of the world can think they are crap because there is not a horse or bull on the hood. We can educate them one lap at a time :D It's normal car BS or HS (pun intended). I was heckled by many close friends for even considering the 12c, it continued after I purchased it. One blast from a stoplight and they are silent, including the Lambo guys... If they do eventually swallow that lump of pride in their throat they usually say something like "now I understand"...
 

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McLaren owners have weird disposition. They're like some weird geek that's bashful for being smart. The 458 is simply inferior to the 12C. It lacks drama and emotion because its slow and doesnt handle as well. Very plain. Very simple. Doesn't mean that more people will like the Mac.

In a lot of ways we enjoy the Seinfeld ideal. Remember that episode about the restaurant he really likes and him saying you don't want it too be too popular a place, because then it becomes difficult to get a seat and the food quality may go down with volume, and you don't want the restaurant to be too unpopular, or it will go out of business. You want it just popular enough to stay in business for your selfish needs.

And for some reason when a Ferrari bursts into flames, people just ignore that. aint that cute. that's a feature! That's awesome! But someone farts in their own 12C and doesnt like how the smell dissipates and it's viewed as some systemic failure of aptitude by Mclaren. Bizzare double standard.

Anyway, I'm with Zilla and 6th. F' the journalists. And F' smug douches. I know what I've got. And what I've got is a brutally awesome performance car that leaves 458 drivers looking limp in my dust.

McLaren has done something so special here. I cannot think of any other car manufacturer that has done something so extraordinary on launch.
 

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I still think that's the Majority of the owners on here,some just get caught up in all the BS,which ever way you look at it,this is one awesome machine !!
 

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McLaren owners have weird disposition. They're like some weird geek that's bashful for being smart. The 458 is simply inferior to the 12C. It lacks drama and emotion because its slow and doesnt handle as well. Very plain. Very simple. Doesn't mean that more people will like the Mac.

In a lot of ways we enjoy the Seinfeld ideal. Remember that episode about the restaurant he really likes and him saying you don't want it too be too popular a place, because then it becomes difficult to get a seat and the food quality may go down with volume, and you don't want the restaurant to be too unpopular, or it will go out of business. You want it just popular enough to stay in business for your selfish needs.

And for some reason when a Ferrari bursts into flames, people just ignore that. aint that cute. that's a feature! That's awesome! But someone farts in their own 12C and doesnt like how the smell dissipates and it's viewed as some systemic failure of aptitude by Mclaren. Bizzare double standard.

Anyway, I'm with Zilla and 6th. F' the journalists. And F' smug douches. I know what I've got. And what I've got is a brutally awesome performance car that leaves 458 drivers looking limp in my dust.

McLaren has done something so special here. I cannot think of any other car manufacturer that has done something so extraordinary on launch.
Although I'm not an owner, I understand what you're saying. Another analogy could be not wanting your favorite band to get too popular and spoil themselves going mainstream. Keep it a secret and it feels more precious.

In my opinion, McLaren has far more 'cool' factor then Ferrari does. One reason for this is the sheer number of Ferraris on the street. The 12c (and McLaren as a whole) has an aura of mystery about it, like a Soviet era MiG that you've only seen in grainy black and white photos as a kid. It's a darker, more sinister product compared to the 'flash' of a Ferrari and that suits my tastes fine.

As for the press, well, if McLaren keep building cars like the 12c, eventually they will have to concede. It's only been a few years and already the writing is on the wall.
 

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Infallible is your word, not mine. What I am saying is so many armchair tycoons here think they could have done better than Ron and his team under the circumstances, when I can guarantee you that not one of us could have, on the aggregate. It's a massive achievement that they have accomplished.
I agree, they have absolutely no idea the monstrous challenges that are involved in an automotive business.
 

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Point being they are feeling the pressure from McLaren. There is no way my local F dealer would be soliciting me, otherwise, for this speciale version (my dealer is THE dealer that was blogged about, that historically does not give a ---- about anybody but its list of serial buyers).

Many here seem to view the past 3 years of McLaren as a series of mistakes. Which is why this forum has become a miserable, boring place to visit (McDc's recent Ring drive excepted). Personally, I see a series of master strokes to get a brand new supercar company off the ground in perhaps the worst economic climate ever to do so. Maybe I'm just an optimist. Some things you can plan for, some you just have to react to. This 458 is not special to me and I agree with others will prob be less special than the scud or CS, despite the heaps of praise on the way from nearly out of work auto journalists. Now, a 12C speciale with 640 hp, 150lbs less, carbon tub and rev2 of PCC, etc...? You really don't think McLaren is well positioned? It wasn't luck, but smart decisions made by Ron and his engineers many moons ago. I'm not interested in what dipshit journalists think. I'm interested in getting the best supercar in the world for the money. The F dealer fellow will not get a response from me to get in line for this 458.
Me neither, I love my car and at this point and time will not trade it in for the world, okay that may be a little excessive yet true. Yet if what 6th states is true and they do come out with an improved version, then I may have to reconsider. Love my putt-putt. Cheers.....??
 

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This is how I would spec mine:
 

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