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I just saw that 6th element already has a thread on this. Mods please delete this if needed.
 

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Very fast and they look it, although the little Lotus 211 with about 250hp does Laguna Seca in the same time and it is an hp track.
 

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the fact that the merc is second says it all... is this a reputable magazine in the states? 'porsche suspension that good'.... come on...
 

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Makes sense with regards to the comments overall. Curious to see what owners who go on racetrack with their MP4 think about this review.
I had my 12C on the racetrack again last night and I agree with every single word that Motor Trend has written. This is a very objective and fair assessment of what the 12C does and how it does it. My buddies last night were in GT3 and RS Porsches with non-stock alignments and running Cup tires. If I'm completely honest, my 12C on standard P Zeros gave up a smidge in the tightest of corners and Brake Steer was working overtime to keep it close. Obviously on the straights, it was no contest. Given the tire grip disadvantage, I was in awe of 12C's inherent capabilities and so were my buddies, who are track junkies and all quite handy behind the wheel. If the 12C was on Cups, or even Corsas, I can't even imagine how insanely capable it would be.

Obviously, nobody likes to finish 5th in a magazine article, but if I'm McLaren PR reading what is actually being said, this is exactly the type of review that will give the brand its unique identity. McLaren is putting all of this technology into the cars to raise performance to a new level and you really cannot argue with that lap time. I doubt that Williams' F1 drivers were complaining that the car was doing everything for them, back when they had active suspensions and lapping 5 seconds faster than everybody else. Now, people will say these are road cars so that is irrelevant. But, actually, it is not. This is exactly how McLaren needs to keep setting themselves apart from its competitors. They need to make cars that can redefine performance. To do so, they may always get shaded in the "feel" department by contenders that are not so focused on speed. But, over the long term, that is what will give the brand its USP and even the press will begin to recognize it as very intentional. Others are only talking about transferring F1 technology to the road; McLaren is actually doing it.

Now, was it fun last night to dice it up on track with RS Porsches in my daily driver? What do you think? :p
 

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well put 6e.... i am just surprised how difficult it seems for people to 'get it'.... its faster and more comfortable etc etc... i loved the 355 when i got in that.. revolutionary.. same again for the 430... loved the ford GT for what it was (and still is..) .. lambo's were always great fun, in the way that lambo's are, whether that be the gallardo or the murcielago (don't think anyway can argue they're not a bit behind the tech curve now, despite the carbon tub..)...GT3 etc porsches are up there with the best no doubt, but ride quality is way off the best today.. i've never been a fan of the 'bog standard' ones, probably cos the GT variants are so good.... but you step out of a 458 and get into a mclaren and go OMG... the tech is just another level and you continue to peel back levels of ability that simply aren't there elsewhere... its just extraordinary to me that it doesn't appear to come across in tests like these....
in a funny kinda way it makes it all the more endearing... its like 'we know something you don't'... but something taht gives the feedback and excitement of the mc for that not to be transmitted to all is slightly perplexing... perhaps its that the limit is so far ahead that very few are getting there when the car would give the sensations that other cars give, at significant less pace...... other than that its just plain stupefyingly (sp?) fast and indeed comfortable. !
 

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I had my 12C on the racetrack again last night and I agree with every single word that Motor Trend has written. This is a very objective and fair assessment of what the 12C does and how it does it. My buddies last night were in GT3 and RS Porsches with non-stock alignments and running Cup tires. If I'm completely honest, my 12C on standard P Zeros gave up a smidge in the tightest of corners and Brake Steer was working overtime to keep it close. Obviously on the straights, it was no contest. Given the tire grip disadvantage, I was in awe of 12C's inherent capabilities and so were my buddies, who are track junkies and all quite handy behind the wheel. If the 12C was on Cups, or even Corsas, I can't even imagine how insanely capable it would be.

Obviously, nobody likes to finish 5th in a magazine article, but if I'm McLaren <acronym title="Google Page Ranking">PR</acronym> reading what is actually being said, this is exactly the type of review that will give the brand its unique identity. McLaren is putting all of this technology into the cars to raise performance to a new level and you really cannot argue with that lap time. I doubt that Williams' F1 drivers were complaining that the car was doing everything for them, back when they had active suspensions and lapping 5 seconds faster than everybody else. Now, people will say these are road cars so that is irrelevant. But, actually, it is not. This is exactly how McLaren needs to keep setting themselves apart from its competitors. They need to make cars that can redefine performance. To do, so they may always get shaded in the "feel" department by contenders that are not so focused on speed. But, over the long term, that is what will give the brand its USP and even the press will begin to recognize it as very intentional. Others are only talking about transferring F1 technology to the road; McLaren is actually doing it.

Now, was it fun last night to dice it up on track with RS Porsches in my daily driver? What do you think? :p
I agree 100%. You really have a great way of expressing on screen the thoughts that most of us owners have about the car.
 

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Again, it seems all about the so called "missing soul" :rolleyes: :confused:

Scubi BRZ lapping a whole 17 (!!!) seconds slower is the better car, more fun ?? Come on, give me a break. Why not adding a 1988 205 GTI to the competition, should make it to the first place easily.

I was sitting in a 12C for the very first time this summer and became one with the car after less than a lap in Goodwood. Only if you are truely open to new concepts, you can fully appreciate what McLaren has accomplished with this car.

It's one hell of a fast car and THE weapon of choice for track days. Great videos to come next year, I promise :)



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Again, it seems all about the so called "missing soul" :rolleyes: :confused:

Scubi BRZ lapping a whole 17 (!!!) seconds slower is the better car, more fun ?? Come on, give me a break. Why not adding a 1988 205 GTI to the competition, should make it to the first place easily.

I was sitting in a 12C for the very first time this summer and became one with the car after less than a lap in Goodwood. Only if you are truely open to new concepts, you can fully appreciate what McLaren has accomplished with this car.

It's one hell of a fast car and THE weapon of choice for track days. Great videos to come next year, I promise :)
Well, everybody has their own definition of fun, which I think is a good thing. We don't want a whole range of Veyron copycats, nor do we want only Miatas and BRZ's to choose from. There have to be different value propositions to allow the various manufacturers to co-exist in the marketplace. If everybody was trying to be exactly like Porsche, they'd all go bankrupt because there could only be one.

Personally, I do use my car on the track occasionally and when I go, I prefer to lap in proximity to my buddies, most of whom happen to drive very capable track cars, too. I don't think I would have had much fun lapping a BRZ last night. Well, maybe for a lap or two, until I got lapped; then, it would probably have gotten pretty old. It's fun to get back the pits and talk about who was running nose to tail, who was faster in this corner, or on that straight. I'm pretty sure if I'd been driving a Ferrari on street tires, I wouldn't have even been a part of the conversation, let alone a BRZ.

But this magazine test wasn't about that. Motor Trend stated very clearly their criteria. The McLaren finished exactly where it should have, both in the subjective evaluation and the lap time.
 

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well put 6e.... i am just surprised how difficult it seems for people to 'get it'.... its faster and more comfortable etc etc... i loved the 355 when i got in that.. revolutionary.. same again for the 430... loved the ford GT for what it was (and still is..) .. lambo's were always great fun, in the way that lambo's are, whether that be the gallardo or the murcielago (don't think anyway can argue they're not a bit behind the tech curve now, despite the carbon tub..)...GT3 etc porsches are up there with the best no doubt, but ride quality is way off the best today.. i've never been a fan of the 'bog standard' ones, probably cos the GT variants are so good.... but you step out of a 458 and get into a mclaren and go OMG... the tech is just another level and you continue to peel back levels of ability that simply aren't there elsewhere... its just extraordinary to me that it doesn't appear to come across in tests like these....
in a funny kinda way it makes it all the more endearing... its like 'we know something you don't'... but something taht gives the feedback and excitement of the mc for that not to be transmitted to all is slightly perplexing... perhaps its that the limit is so far ahead that very few are getting there when the car would give the sensations that other cars give, at significant less pace...... other than that its just plain stupefyingly (sp?) fast and indeed comfortable. !
Some things are just not there to "get", I think. Compare to Sport Auto, which scores performance much more objectively and factors in the Ring time. They gave the 12C a perfect 70/70 score, I think. Different criteria, that's all.
 

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Something else interesting I just noticed. The 12C posted identical 0-60 (2.9s) and 1/4 mile (10.8) times to the Aventador, although the Lambo trapped slightly higher in the quarter. Accels presumably with a one-foot rollout.

Also, the Aventador weighed 300 (!!) pounds heavier than the prototype they weighed previously in Europe.
 

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Something else interesting I just noticed. The 12C posted identical 0-60 (2.9s) and 1/4 mile (10.8) times to the Aventador, although the Lambo trapped slightly higher in the quarter. Accels presumably with a one-foot rollout.

Also, the Aventador weighed 300 (!!) pounds heavier than the prototype they weighed previously in Europe.
It is a heavy car no doubt. Drive one, feel it instantly. Sounds like Lambo is being cheap, and cutting corners with laminate, instead of actual pure cf like what is advertised. Car really needs a PDK or Audi's new DCT
 

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It is a heavy car no doubt. Drive one, feel it instantly. Sounds like Lambo is being cheap, and cutting corners with laminate, instead of actual pure cf like what is advertised. Car really needs a PDK or Audi's new DCT
Were the 1,000+ units sold on what basis? Was it hype?

It seems most die-hard Lamborghini fans, Mr. Catz included, haven't warmed up to the Aventador. I keep hearing various reasons, from overly tame, to different feel with the new engine's longdrawn firing order, to a mechanically masochistic ISR. Think their profit margin is higher than a similarly priced f12?
 

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From what I'm reading, seems like the run was done in Track Track but with the electronic stability still on. Not disengaged. So the car should be even quicker and have more natural response
 
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