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Discussion Starter #1
After 7000 miles I'm not sure if I have mastered Brake Steer. At slow speeds I can feel a pronounced 'over-steer' to the apex, very quick and precise. That is Brake Steer I presume.

But at higher speeds I find an under-steer on medium radius corners, almost as though the car is demanding a more direct steering input so I have been experimenting and , indeed , a more direct turn of the wheel puts the car on rails.

What is consensus on how to get Brake Steer working
 

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After 7000 miles I'm not sure if I have mastered Brake Steer. At slow speeds I can feel a pronounced 'over-steer' to the apex, very quick and precise. That is Brake Steer I presume.

But at higher speeds I find an under-steer on medium radius corners, almost as though the car is demanding a more direct steering input so I have been experimenting and , indeed , a more direct turn of the wheel puts the car on rails.

What is consensus on how to get Brake Steer working
RIC as long as you do NOT use it in REVERSE you will be ok ! :D:D:D
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Robbie, I have had more success with it in reverse, honest:eek:
 

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After 7000 miles I'm not sure if I have mastered Brake Steer. At slow speeds I can feel a pronounced 'over-steer' to the apex, very quick and precise. That is Brake Steer I presume.

But at higher speeds I find an under-steer on medium radius corners, almost as though the car is demanding a more direct steering input so I have been experimenting and , indeed , a more direct turn of the wheel puts the car on rails.

What is consensus on how to get Brake Steer working
Its definately more obvious on tight bends,and easy to get it working if you turn in aggressively,we all have our favorite corners and thats where i have my most fun with it.
But regarding it being usefull at speed,i would say its more because i got it wrong and was travelling too fast on the road.But i agree it does feel like its on rails if you are precise so it could easily be working in a more sutble way and you need to be thinking about it to feel it happening.I never did notice it on the track,but it must have been there,so that would be more to do with buzz i was having than thinking about anything else
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Andy, when you say it saved you did you feel it pull the car to the apex? I could see how journalists would moan about that.
 

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On my recent hill climb experience at Prescott, it was the first time that brake steer had been obviously apparent when driving the car. This was around a gradual left hand bend just after the start, although I hadn’t realised what was going on until about my tenth run – doh!!!

Once you realise what is happening, it just gives you more confidence to go faster and in no way, did it feel artificial, just the car doing its stuff.

Interestingly, it’s existence was not apparent around the rest of the bends (including hair pins), but I am sure it was there, doing its stuff, just not so conspicuously.

Also lost the back end a couple of times on left handers when in track/track, but copious opposite lock saved the day, although I am sure much was down to the electronics and not my driving skills.

Best comment of the day was “That McLaren driven wasn’t hanging around”, but that was only because of the confidence that the car inspires and the un-noticed, electronic assistance.

May not be pure, but keeps me happy and pampers to my limited abilities.
 

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The brake-steer is so surreal and I love it, a total blast. It works best when pitching the car into turns where you would expect to have the car push and then hold the wheel steady (off the brakes) and the car just turns in, once pointed at the apex apply throttle for a mild over-steer exit. I think it works best when the steering input is kept steady while off the brakes.

I am too handsy with the wheel in this video after a week of ownership but there are several areas where I can see the car just yawing towards the apex as the tires give a bit of squeal.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMPtiOsLwdM
 

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Here is a little clip to illustrate, comparing my friend's Audi S4 through a left/right complex. Obviously, I realize there is a performance mismatch compared to the 12C, but if you watch closely, you can see Brake Steer working and the S4 footage serves to amplify the difference.

The S4 is the first part of the clip. The left-hander is a compromised corner, since you need to get back to the left quickly for the next corner's entry. He has a little understeer, but recovers well to get set up for the right hander. But then, he tries to carry too much of that momentum and understeers badly in the right hander, which is actually a tighter corner than it looks on video.

Next, my 12C. I'm through the left-hander cleanly, with probably a little bit of assist from Brake Steer, helping me keep the car from tracking all the way out. But then, watch closely on the entry to the right-hander: At turn-in, for a split second the car understeers, just like the S4 did - you can actually see the car wanting to push left to the outside. Then, the next instant, the nose darts back to the right, towards the apex. (don't look at the front of the car, instead focus on the apex and you will see it easier)


By my stopwatch, that's about 2.5 to 3 tenths of a second gained in that left/right alone, which is mostly braking and turning, but the bigger gain would be at the end of the next straight, the 12C having been able to get back to throttle sooner.

I think what some journalists are doing, when they feel that initial split second of understeer, is taking off some lock to kill the understeer, from instinct. Which is exactly what you don't want to do, because that will also tell Brake Steer it's not needed any more and then you are in no man's land, sailing wide. You actually want to keep steering directly to the apex and get back on the throttle as quickly as possible, which will keep Brake Steer working, without interruption, through the middle phase and exit phase of the corner. The tricky part is that you need to trust that Brake Steer will kick in.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
6TH. see what you are saying in that vid, thanks for posting.

Can you 'feel' the brake steer in a bend like that?
 

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Discussion Starter #11
The brake-steer is so surreal and I love it, a total blast. It works best when pitching the car into turns where you would expect to have the car push and then hold the wheel steady (off the brakes) and the car just turns in, once pointed at the apex apply throttle for a mild over-steer exit. I think it works best when the steering input is kept steady while off the brakes.

I am too handsy with the wheel in this video after a week of ownership but there are several areas where I can see the car just yawing towards the apex as the tires give a bit of squeal.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMPtiOsLwdM
Thanks for the vid falb. There seems to be multiple apex bends but you can see the car 'pull/turn' in I think.

Not a slow track:D
 

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6TH. see what you are saying in that vid, thanks for posting.

Can you 'feel' the brake steer in a bend like that?
Yes, definitely, because the transition from the initial moment of understeer is quite pronounced. The more understeer you expect, the more you will feel the Brake Steer counter it. That is why it is difficult to notice on the street, as you rarely put the car into a situation where it would understeer that badly (lest you end up in the ditch).
 
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