McLaren Life banner

1161 - 1180 of 1229 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
711 Posts
The back is the best view. From the front it is more of a horror show.
Will be very interesting to see the real world weight of the car. Word on the street is that, when Fat Larry took over Aston, one of his first acts was to order that major cuts be made to the cost of building a Valkyrie, and the main result was a substantial increase in weight.
weight has certainly gone up from the 1000kgs they talked about, but so has power. will be interesting to see if they can keep the 1:1 ratio on power vs weight.
if a Senna is at 1200kgs, anything above that for the valkyrie must be seen as a disapointment. big V12 and hybrid system not withstanding
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,079 Posts
1200 kg seems pretty damn heavy for a car that looks like CF origami and a tiny tiny tiny cockpit. Still the coolest car out there, but it's gotta be extremely light unless they went the Ford GT route...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,886 Posts
weight has certainly gone up from the 1000kgs they talked about, but so has power. will be interesting to see if they can keep the 1:1 ratio on power vs weight.
if a Senna is at 1200kgs, anything above that for the valkyrie must be seen as a disapointment. big V12 and hybrid system not withstanding
1:1 power ratio even at 1250kg is quiet good ... Senna is likely around 800/1275 in reality which is sth around 1:1,65
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,886 Posts
1200 kg seems pretty damn heavy for a car that looks like CF origami and a tiny tiny tiny cockpit. Still the coolest car out there, but it's gotta be extremely light unless they went the Ford GT route...
the cf stuff is not heavy .... but that’s similar to a Senna or 765LT ... the Heavy stuff is the 6l V12, hybrid system, cooling, heat shielding and the big big wheels plus brake ...
 
  • Like
Reactions: ZombiePhysicist

·
Registered
Joined
·
711 Posts
given the hype around the car I am really looking forward to hard numbers of performance ... I guess that’s all that really matters, even with these made up marketing stories ...
why do people talk about the Aston F1 car? that is just a marketing ageement, not really different from the redbull marketing deal. Aston Martin doesnt own anything of racing point or whatever company name it operates under now last time i checked
1:1 power ratio even at 1250kg is quiet good ... Senna is likely around 800/1275 in reality which is sth around 1:1,65
1250 would be a massive disapointment
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,886 Posts
why do people talk about the Aston F1 car? that is just a marketing ageement, not really different from the redbull marketing deal. Aston Martin doesnt own anything of racing point or whatever company name it operates under now last time i checked

1250 would be a massive disapointment
AM came up with this story ... I also don’t really understand it. In my view the Valkyrie is a fully bespoke project that does not share much with anything AM ever made besides the logo and some styling hints (which hopefully are performance neutral) ...

1250 if combined with 1250hp would not be that bad actually ... if you look at the t50 (extreme lightweight/much smaller car and engine which is non hybrid) it can barely stay below 1000kg and has a power to weight ratio of about 1:1,45 ... to my knowledge there is no road legal production car that got to 1:1 or anywhere near (being a lightweight car below 1500kg) so far (excluding maybe Keggs on E85, which as far as I know is only a claim never independently proofed)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,886 Posts
Isn’t the F1 connection a reference to the Valkyrie being a Newey design?
well its more or less ONLY marketing, as Newey works for RB and has zero connection to the Racing Point/AM F1 ... this is kind of a very weak connection as all sports car manufacturers basically link their products to some form of racing (LM or F1 of course being the most in demand ones as they draw the most attention of ppl less in the know)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,122 Posts
AM came up with this story ... I also don’t really understand it. In my view the Valkyrie is a fully bespoke project that does not share much with anything AM ever made besides the logo and some styling hints (which hopefully are performance neutral) ...

1250 if combined with 1250hp would not be that bad actually ... if you look at the t50 (extreme lightweight/much smaller car and engine which is non hybrid) it can barely stay below 1000kg and has a power to weight ratio of about 1:1,45 ... to my knowledge there is no road legal production car that got to 1:1 or anywhere near (being a lightweight car below 1500kg) so far (excluding maybe Keggs on E85, which as far as I know is only a claim never independently proofed)
T50 could probably be 1:1 at 750-800 kg (certain markets I'm sure could get away without the super restrictive Euro exhaust requirements, could go with a bigger displacement engine at the expense of response) with very small cabin like Valkyrie/LMP car and barely seating for 2, or even 1 seater, no luggage consideration, no fan, and lightweight body panels of T50s. It wouldn't be Gordon's vision of a usable road car, but I'm sure he could get it done. Depends on if you consider the 1:1 with fluids or not.

1250 kg for Valkyrie would make the prospect of T50 sweeter on the road. That would be a 600 pound difference :O
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
711 Posts
T50 could probably be 1:1 at 750-800 kg (certain markets I'm sure could get away without the super restrictive Euro exhaust requirements, could go with a bigger displacement engine at the expense of response) with very small cabin like Valkyrie/LMP car and barely seating for 2, or even 1 seater, no luggage consideration, no fan, and lightweight body panels of T50s. It wouldn't be Gordon's vision of a usable road car, but I'm sure he could get it done. Depends on if you consider the 1:1 with fluids or not.

1250 kg for Valkyrie would make the prospect of T50 sweeter on the road. That would be a 600 pound difference :O
not sure if you are joking, the Valkyrie could be at 2:1 with 1200bhp and 600kgs.. that is as realistic as your 750kg weight on the T50
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,122 Posts
not sure if you are joking, the Valkyrie could be at 2:1 with 1200bhp and 600kgs.. that is as realistic as your 750kg weight on the T50
Cut 5-10 kg out of the fan, bodywork, and ducting/valving. 30%+ smaller cockpit would mean more rigidity and less volume, more distance for side impact crash to passenger/driver. Could go thinner on A pillars, roof, etc. 20-25 kg there, windshield glass and side glass would be smaller, another couple of kg there. No need for luggage, just use thinnest carbon sheet possible on the rear 3/4, save 2 kg. Take out AC, another 5-10 kg. Get to dry weight, another 20 kg. No need for 48 Volt integrated starter unit, another 5+ kg. Starting to get there... That would be about 780 kg on a T50s type design. Not to mention you could make the car even smaller as a 2 seater in terms of overall dimensions (fore and aft and even side to side)

Valkyrie is a much larger and more complicated car with active aero/suspension than T50. It ain't getting anywhere near 800 kg EVER, no matter what you do. T50s without aero would already be near 800 kg dry without touching anything else.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,826 Posts
AM came up with this story ... I also don’t really understand it. In my view the Valkyrie is a fully bespoke project that does not share much with anything AM ever made besides the logo and some styling hints (which hopefully are performance neutral) ...

1250 if combined with 1250hp would not be that bad actually ... if you look at the t50 (extreme lightweight/much smaller car and engine which is non hybrid) it can barely stay below 1000kg and has a power to weight ratio of about 1:1,45 ... to my knowledge there is no road legal production car that got to 1:1 or anywhere near (being a lightweight car below 1500kg) so far (excluding maybe Keggs on E85, which as far as I know is only a claim never independently proofed)
If given the choice for a road car, you would always, always prefer to have lower weight/less power than to have equal percentages of more weight/more power.
Where it gets tricky is in modern racing cars with high downforce. For the same weight the DF generates additional resistance, through which the power must push the car. There is a tipping point whereby the advantages of lighter weight are less than the advantages of more power combined with more downforce.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,122 Posts
If given the choice for a road car, you would always, always prefer to have lower weight/less power than to have equal percentages of more weight/more power.
Where it gets tricky is in modern racing cars with high downforce. For the same weight the DF generates additional resistance, through which the power must push the car. There is a tipping point whereby the advantages of lighter weight are less than the advantages of more power combined with more downforce.
Exactly. There is power to weight which affects acceleration and then there's downforce to weight ratio which affects peak cornering performance (in combination with mechanical grip).

Not to say you would ever want to be doing peak cornering on the road. The lightweight lower moment of inertia will be felt through quick changes of direction.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,886 Posts
If given the choice for a road car, you would always, always prefer to have lower weight/less power than to have equal percentages of more weight/more power.
Where it gets tricky is in modern racing cars with high downforce. For the same weight the DF generates additional resistance, through which the power must push the car. There is a tipping point whereby the advantages of lighter weight are less than the advantages of more power combined with more downforce.
Well that’s of course true as basically most power in excess of 450-500hp could not be used effectively on a road car anyway due to various limiting factors ... therefore getting smaller, lighter and more nimble has a bigger benefit
 

·
2012 MP4-12C
Joined
·
8,384 Posts
weight has certainly gone up from the 1000kgs they talked about, but so has power. will be interesting to see if they can keep the 1:1 ratio on power vs weight.
if a Senna is at 1200kgs, anything above that for the valkyrie must be seen as a disapointment. big V12 and hybrid system not withstanding
Isn’t the Gordon Murray car under 1000kg? This starts to look bad for the Aston team.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,886 Posts
Isn’t the Gordon Murray car under 1000kg? This starts to look bad for the Aston team.
T50 has a non hybrid 4 liter V12 with 680hp - Valkyrie is 6.2 Liter V12 hybrid system with 1150-1250hp rumored ...
 
  • Like
Reactions: oxia

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,886 Posts
Isn’t the t50s only 850kg and something like 750hp? So decently close. True, not road legal.
986kg dry - the track version is lighter and more powerful( but unable to ever meet road legal requirements)
 
  • Like
Reactions: ZombiePhysicist
1161 - 1180 of 1229 Posts
Top