[mocha]

I recommend keeping your 675LT until after driving a 765LT. Everyone has a different perspective of what constitutes ‘different enough’ so only you can make that decision. I’ve come to learn that many users on these forums sense things that I don’t (ie. downforce helping grip on public roads).

That's hilarious! Downforce on public roads? Who are these people? And what kind of public roads are they using, safely, to experience variations in downforce? Gimme a break!

 

[Twosherpaz]

I just tracked both back to back Wednesday. I significantly prefer the 765LT to the 675LT on track and street because it is faster, has better road feel, and gives you more confidence turning and controlling the car in all situations.

I’m not a professional racer but with over 300 track days in the last five years, I’m neither a novice nor slow. The 765 simply gives you greater confidence stopping, turning, accelerating AND it is much faster.

I’m not planning to sell either 675, but I do very much like the 765. Mostly not selling the 675s because they are far better cars than the current market price.

I track my Senna GTR quite a bit. The 765 is like a baby Senna GTR.

 

[tb993tt]

That's hilarious! Downforce on public roads? Who are these people? And what kind of public roads are they using, safely, to experience variations in downforce? Gimme a break!

You realise that this is an international forum and many in Europe are likely to be able to feel the relative downforce on the autobahn where 300kph+ very easily achieved with the sort of grunt the 765 has ?

 

[shack]

I am not writing it off but lets face it, the STO is just another iteration of the Huracan. Just Lambo milking it as usual. That said I am sure it will be a fine car.

Same as Porsche I guess - except they make 60 different versions of the same thing. Doesn't stop people buying them and enjoying them I am sure

 

[Cadster]

I just tracked both back to back Wednesday. I significantly prefer the 765LT to the 675LT on track and street because it is faster, has better road feel, and gives you more confidence turning and controlling the car in all situations.

I’m not a professional racer but with over 300 track days in the last five years, I’m neither a novice nor slow. The 765 simply gives you greater confidence stopping, turning, accelerating AND it is much faster.

I’m not planning to sell either 675, but I do very much like the 765. Mostly not selling the 675s because they are far better cars than the current market price.

I track my Senna GTR quite a bit. The 765 is like a baby Senna GTR.

Twosherpaz is like EF Hutton. His bona fides are well documented, and so this counts as high praise.

On a side note, Shadow, now that more reviews are coming from esteemed sources with good amounts of seat time both on track and on the road, are your initial concerns beginning to dissipate?

 

[Capsfan]

Same as Porsche I guess - except they make 60 different versions of the same thing. Doesn't stop people buying them and enjoying them I am sure

True and performance from one to another is also marginal unless you go to a 2rs or TTS.

 

[shadowfax]

Twosherpaz is like EF Hutton. His bona fides are well documented, and so this counts as high praise.

On a side note, Shadow, now that more reviews are coming from esteemed sources with good amounts of seat time both on track and on the road, are your initial concerns beginning to dissipate?

My doubts were not about questioning whether the driver engagement and general enjoyment of the 765 was up to the quoted high standard even though a few here tried their level best to discredit me over my concerns - and still do - ....seems to be their main focus oddly? That said, I would have been very surprised to have heard that the driver engagement or general performance was not up to high standard, but again this was NOT what I was mainly concerned about! This I believe I have made clear previously though?

The points which I had raised earlier (in the depreciation thread discussion etc) were mainly centered around whether the car was able to produce a competitive track time due to the certain twitchy behavior being reported during cornering along with the mention of intractability - reported by the 3 racers CH, Ollie and Christian Gebhart ....who all expressed similar concerns.

Whilst there have been many glowing reviews since - owners mainly, and certain journos - reporting positively about the way their car drives and looks - this is not of any real surprise to me at all. I am however surprised that we are all still yet to see Mclaren respond with a follow up to their original letter - and, even more surprised still yet to see any further attempts to re place the car time-wise on a circuit by recognized pro racers. It isn't as if cars have not been available either. We have read numerous reviews inc the most recent Pcoty but have oddly not seen any times. If it were any other manufacturer this would also no doubt be questioned.

Now of course all this may not matter or be of any consequence to most who buy this car, which is largely understandable as few would be able to extract the cars full potential on a circuit as the racers are able to do. But it does have relevance in other areas such as market/product standing amongst alternate brand offerings, and I'm sure the level of depreciation will become part of that equation at one point too!

Insofar as whether it will matter to me personally? No, as i'm not a professional racer with their level of talent either. However, as a buyer who plans tracking the car, it is a comforting thought knowing that the car you have just spent a lot of money on is at least able to demonstrate it is capable of producing a better time than its predecessor and, general competitors already in the market, along the same vein which the competition is able to provide and, demonstrate with ITS new models. This is not an unreasonable expectation for any buyer to have. As an example I doubt we are going to see the new Gt3 produce a slower time than its predecessor least of all be less engaging to drive. Same with STO.

Keeping in mind there are always new models coming out which also have focus on providing solid driver engagement -STO and new GT3 being the next likely to surface - these brands have all historically shown their newer car CAN produce superior lap times not only to their predecessors, but also amongst their competitors. So one would fairly and reasonable expect that Mclaren is able to do the same - or maybe I'm the odd man out here? Anyway....

First and foremost, driver engagement is a key element which I expect out of a car along with proper sound, superior ergonomic, and precise driver controls which modulate properly (ie. brake throttle steering). These are also not unreasonable expectations for a car of this standard and value, and on all accounts to date I should not be disappointed by 765 - the same applies to other brands as well although some have sadly shown certain deficiency and disappointment in the areas of sound, modulation of controls, inadequate brakes etc even though a very high price was paid along with manufacturer claims of superior performance which didn't fully materialize.

So in closing, - and apology for such long post - am I keen to get into my 765? Yes absolutely!!....apparently due late month early next. I'm sure I will not be disappointed BUT whether my original concerns are resolved is still yet to be seen.

PS; and re twosherpaz 765 user report - agree huge Kudos to 2sherpa for owning one of THE most envious car collections on the planet AND residing more or less on the side of a racetrack! Now what a situation! Incredible! Does it get any better than that?

 

[Coincid]

While we all want the 765 to set high objective standards and track performance that leads in its segment, for the overhelming majority of owners, driver engagement off the track is of particular relevance since that is the venue where the preponderance of driving will take place. You were fixated not only on the issue of the 765 track competency based predominately on one race, you further frequently voiced your trepidation about the driving behaviour of the car on road, quoting Chris Harris, a reviewer you hold in high esteem, who felt as a road car, the 765 was skittish, unpredictable, over powered and not enjoyable. Since then, a bevy of owners have waxed lyrical over the 765's compelling, thrilling and stellar road performance. At least, you now seem to have calmed your angst over that issue.

 

[Jas]

I am however surprised that we are all still yet to see Mclaren respond with a follow up to their original letter - and, even more surprised still yet to see any further attempts to re place the car time-wise on a circuit by recognized pro racers. It isn't as if cars have not been available either.

Bear in mind it's Winter, and the UK is in a severe lockdown. So don't expect any timed circuit tests for some months.

Given how incredibly the 765LT drives, I have have confidence it will do very well.

The car is utterly incredible and by far the best road car I've ever driven.

 

[shack]

The car is utterly incredible and by far the best road car I've ever driven.

What conditions did you drive it in and did you have Trofeo R's ?

Also as its lower than my 600LTS (which has SlipLo's) did u find any bottoming out on B and C roads?

 

[shadowfax]

Bear in mind it's Winter, and the UK is in a severe lockdown. So don't expect any timed circuit tests for some months.

Given how incredibly the 765LT drives, I have have confidence it will do very well.

The car is utterly incredible and by far the best road car I've ever driven.

I understand UK is in lockdown but there are many other countries (with race circuits and pro drivers) which are not.

I also note Mclaren is still able to ship cars all around the world...

As previously stated - i would have been very surprised to find the car not engaging and ‘exciting’ to drive’. This was never my point although i aknowledge a few pathetic individuals - one in particular who is still chipping away - have desperately tried all sorts of angles to make out it is a major concern of mine.

I understand your enthusiasm and excitement - im sure i would be the same there - but 765 is clearly a track focused car so elements such as ride and sound intrusion would not make it the best least of all most versatile road going car.....

 

[Cadster]

I understand UK is in lockdown but there are many other countries (with race circuits and pro drivers) which are not.

I also note Mclaren is still able to ship cars all around the world...

As previously stated - i would have been very surprised to find the car not engaging and ‘exciting’ to drive’. This was never my point although i aknowledge a few pathetic individuals - one in particular who is still chipping away - have desperately tried all sorts of angles to make out it is a major concern of mine.

I understand your enthusiasm and excitement - im sure i would be the same there - but 765 is clearly a track focused car so elements such as ride and sound intrusion would not make it the best least of all most versatile road going car.....

Come on Shadow....just let it go. We’ve moved on. In fact, I had nearly forgotten about your Sport Auto test freak out until you just reminded us. Just kidding amigo. Truly not trying wind you back up again.

 

[shadowfax]

Come on Shadow....just let it go. We’ve moved on. In fact, I had nearly forgotten about your Sport Auto test freak out until you just reminded us. Just kidding amigo. Truly not trying wind you back up again.

I know youve moved on thankfully cadster but i see the comedians best pal coincid is still chipping away at it - trying to find a way of getting square somehow lol. Meanwhile the rest of the world has moved on.

 

[Jas]

What conditions did you drive it in and did you have Trofeo R's ?

Also as its lower than my 600LTS (which has SlipLo's) did u find any bottoming out on B and C roads?

See here for full details pls: (63) 765LT drive - my street test review & day at MTC | McLaren Life

To answer your specific questions though, I requested PZeros as the conditions were terrible (v cold and wet). My own 765LTS will have Trofeo R.

I had no issue with it bottoming out, but don't recall traversing any speed bumps. But then, I also had no such issue with a 600LTS I test drove, so perhaps it's just a matter of finding a bad enough road or speed bump.

 

[Jas]

elements such as ride and sound intrusion would not make it the best least of all most versatile road going car.....

I'm not sure you appreciate the impact of lockdown on a small company like McLaren. Shipping a car to a warm/hot location with a test crew just to set a time won't be on their list of priorities, and nor should it be.

I am sure plenty of timed tests will come in Spring/Summer.

I don't recall anyone claiming the 765LT is the most versatile road going car? I'm not sure there is such a thing as a "most versatile road going car", but my 720S would beat any LT on that measure, and my Ferrari Lusso would handsomely beat my 720S.

I'm sure you fully realise the 765LT is designed to thrill and excite, at the expense of some NVH and comfort. That's a trade-off I desire, as does every other 765LT buyer I am sure.

 

[Coincid]

Is anyone purchasing the 765 for its versatility? Clearly not. It is being bought because it is so immersive, raw and engaging.

 

[shadowfax]

Dont recall anyone - myself inc- saying they were buying a 765 expecting versatility? The point i made was to do with jas saying the 765 was the best rd car hed driven so pointed out rd noise intrusion and harsher ride would exclude it from the context of being the best rd car vs other sportscar offerings. It was pretty clear but poor ole coincid just couldnt help himself lol. True to form.

Atta boy keep chipping away!
Liitle wonder that comedian picked him out of the crowd 😂

 

[shadowfax]

I'm not sure you appreciate the impact of lockdown on a small company like McLaren. Shipping a car to a warm/hot location with a test crew just to set a time won't be on their list of priorities, and nor should it be.

I am sure plenty of timed tests will come in Spring/Summer.

I don't recall anyone claiming the 765LT is the most versatile road going car? I'm not sure there is such a thing as a "most versatile road going car", but my 720S would beat any LT on that measure, and my Ferrari Lusso would handsomely beat my 720S.

I'm sure you fully realise the 765LT is designed to thrill and excite, at the expense of some NVH and comfort. That's a trade-off I desire, as does every other 765LT buyer I am sure.

Its never stopped journos and other reviewers who’ve taken these types of cars to circuit from doing their own independent time trials. So many vids out there which support this truth. Few multiple car tests involving reviewers expect each maker to attend with their pit crews and engineers to support these types of drives yet times get used to establish their pecking order on the day. Just saying..

 

[Jas]

Dont recall anyone - myself inc- saying they were buying a 765 expecting versatility? The point i made was to do with jas saying the 765 was the best rd car hed driven so pointed out rd noise intrusion and harsher ride would exclude it from the context of being the best rd car vs other sportscar offerings.😂

Thanks for clarifying what you meant.

Equally, it should be implicit that when I say its the best road car I've driven, that needs to be taken in the context of supercars. I am not saying it's the most comfortable, most quiet or most practical.

The relevance of saying me "road car", was that I excluded track cars. Simply because you can't compare the two types. As an aside, the best track car I've driven is the Brabham BT62.

 

[Coincid]

.

I

I understand your enthusiasm and excitement - im sure i would be the same there - but 765 is clearly a track focused car so elements such as ride and sound intrusion would not make it the best least of all most versatile road going car.....
[/QUOTE]

Your comment is beyond obvious. Anyone buying the 765 is well aware that it is track focused, raw and unfiltered and thusly will not be the most versatile road car. JAS also replied to your statement " I don't recall anyone claiming the 765LT is the most versatile road going car"?