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The McLaren GT is sitting on the side crying.
750S, thoughts on the McLaren 720S replacement
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McLaren has also built a highly innovative, technically highly reliable (irony) three-seater hybrid with 1070hp and a DIN kerb weight of 1,597 kg (3521 lbs). The car was so ingenious that it was obviously forgotten by an entire mclaren fan internet forum and has not found its way into "mass production"...
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p1 and Speedstail use a quiet similar system … actually that’s more or less a m840 update from the P1 M838 and some changes to the battery system … however I did not write it bc a recent 2,4m hypercar with a lot less in common with a regular McL than the P1 was somehow unfitting …
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296GTB is rear-wheel drive, the SF90 is all-wheel drive, I think that's where the difference lies. The pure total system performance numbers at this level are already almost irrelevant.
My thoughts: there are many different hybrid concepts: serial hybrid, parallel hybrid, power split or mixed hybrid as well as mild hybrid, full hybrid and plug-in hybrid and then two or four wheel drive.
In my eyes, the big question is the choice of concept. At the current performance level, the question of the right concept is decisive. The differentiation will lie in the choice and design of the concepts, not in the pure system performance values. I can imagine that McLaren wants to go over the books once again with regard to the hybrid concept for the 720S successor.
My thoughts: there are many different hybrid concepts: serial hybrid, parallel hybrid, power split or mixed hybrid as well as mild hybrid, full hybrid and plug-in hybrid and then two or four wheel drive.
In my eyes, the big question is the choice of concept. At the current performance level, the question of the right concept is decisive. The differentiation will lie in the choice and design of the concepts, not in the pure system performance values. I can imagine that McLaren wants to go over the books once again with regard to the hybrid concept for the 720S successor.
Yeah- totally spaced on that! There goes my brilliant analysis. That’s what I get for trying to post late at night! Forget everything I said!
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They make all their cars to generate cash......in theory,lol.
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Anyway its about perception and since McL won't have another non limited non hypercar model above the 720s replacement it needs to compete with everything that a normal person can buy at Lambo and Ferrari below LE Hypercars ... thats the V8TT and V12 Hybrids not the by then outgoing V6TT Hybrid in the middle of the lineup
Concerning the Aventador replacement.
I was at a preview event and while the numbers are impressiv i think real world could be a bit different.
NA engine is beautifull in sound, but not as effectiv as turbo engine performance wise.
812 superfast vs F8/Pista, both turbo engine cars are faster despite on paper be down of almost 100hp..
Lets say the Aventador succesor has about 850hp from the NA engine (and a good 200hp from elec), i bet the 850hp are more like 750 turbo engine Hp.
And real world weight will be around 1900kg, even if the factory claims other thing
I do think the aventador succesor will be on the level of the Sf90, no more no less (More power on paper, but more weight).
I am pretty sure if mclaren is going for the 720s hybrid succesor, 900hp (and less weight) would be far enough to outrune Aventador succesor and a potential SF90 Vs..
Maybe not a low speed if only rearwheel driven, for sur on higher speed.
I was at a preview event and while the numbers are impressiv i think real world could be a bit different.
NA engine is beautifull in sound, but not as effectiv as turbo engine performance wise.
812 superfast vs F8/Pista, both turbo engine cars are faster despite on paper be down of almost 100hp..
Lets say the Aventador succesor has about 850hp from the NA engine (and a good 200hp from elec), i bet the 850hp are more like 750 turbo engine Hp.
And real world weight will be around 1900kg, even if the factory claims other thing
I do think the aventador succesor will be on the level of the Sf90, no more no less (More power on paper, but more weight).
I am pretty sure if mclaren is going for the 720s hybrid succesor, 900hp (and less weight) would be far enough to outrune Aventador succesor and a potential SF90 Vs..
Maybe not a low speed if only rearwheel driven, for sur on higher speed.
Several factors such as the AWD question on the customer survey, the fact that they are out of alignment in power level with Ferrari, and the adjustment to a lower production level lend to the expectation that they are going to move upmarket with the replacement. Although the first two decisions were made before their most recent financial struggles.
Not sure if the McLaren V6 was designed to handle higher power like the Ferrari V6. Mclaren is undersquare bore/stroke while the Ferrari uses the same combustion chamber as the SF90 which is oversquare. Can't determine all engine characteristics with B/S ratio that but in general overquare tends to make peak power higher in the rev range while even if you rev an equivalent undersquare motor to the same rev limit it will peak much earlier. By basic physics electric motors drop off in power/torque at higher revs so just adding more electric power wouldn't solve the problem (and this already seems to be a problem with the Artura).
Why Ferrari and McLaren Debuted 120-Degree V-6s at the Same Time
McLaren's 577-hp M640 V-6 will go in the Artura, while Ferrari's new 654-hp F163 engine will be in the 296GTB.
www.caranddriver.com
Agreed
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Moving upmarket won’t work for mclaren if the market around them actually gets cheaper at normalizing 1000hp hybrid cars … we can expect that the next 1000hp Ferrari hybrid after the SF90 won’t be priced higher than the SF90 but lower while the sf90 replacement will have more power (1200-1250 maybe)
Discharge rate and power density are different things than energy density. You can have a small battery with a high power output but that amount of power may only be available for a short duration (energy). Also I wonder why the Artura electric system is only 400v if they Mclaren Applied have experience with developing higher voltage systems.
Well they can market AWD as the differentiating factor? Not sure how convincing that is as people seem to prefer the 296 over the SF90. I wonder if the next Artura will move upmarket as Artura has carbon chassis + fancy body panels + hybrid while 296 is just hybrid and $100k more.
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Well I wrote it before and I still think it’s the same: Ferrari and Mclaren don’t have the same buyers … of course some very wealthy ppl buy both brands and have collections or at least 3+ such cars from different brands, but simply put most mclaren buyers moved upward from Porsche 911/ Audi R8 etc while most Ferrari buyers are more buying the car as a status symbol and the brand is positioned closer to the luxury market than McL … additionally Ferrari has about 4-5x the client base if not 10x …
From this comes the observation that mclaren clients are way more price sensitive than Ferrari clients and Mclaren can easily price itself out of a significant part of its market … therefore the replacement of the 720s cannot be priced too high (330-350k base seem to work - 400-420 won’t) … power ratings and other numbers won’t change much about that as the ppl at some point just won’t buy the cars anymore … and simply put a SF90 or V12 Lambo even if inferior from its performance carries more social status, which is a big part for many owners … maybe not so much the ones here in the forum, where the discussion is mainly technical and performance related but more on the street …
after driving a ferrari, lamborghini and porsche a few times, I decided to to try my hand on a 720s and after buying and owning it will never look back. It is a better car. I don't even cross shop it anymore.
I just sold my Pista to buy another Mclaren. 🤷🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️
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pics ?
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