McLaren Life banner
41 - 56 of 56 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
I think a lot will depend on the energy density of the batteries available when the time comes. It'll presumably be a version of the Artura ICE with more power, plus whatever they can get out of a relatively lightweight battery pack.
That seems like a good call. If McLaren were to retain the V8 when going hybrid for the next generation car, then justifying P1 values would be very difficult.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
244 Posts
My best bet would be still on V8 hybrid for 720s successor. If you consider Lamborghini is going to put a V12 Hybrid into the Aventador successor then mcLaren would have to a hard time selling a V6 habrid 720S successor...Also McLaren will need a V8 Hybrid engine anyway for P1 sucessor so it would make sense they would also use it in the Super Series.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
107 Posts
@Bridster what's a wet cylinder liner?
Is your Google broken? :mad:

Alright, alright, I will play along! Wet cylinder liner is a liner that's in direct contact with the coolant. This means it basically acts as the sole structure for the wall of the cylinder and needs to be pretty big and heavy - and that's made worse by the fact that the cylinder liner will be made from cast iron. Really, though, I think the main point is that Mclaren have been using cylinder liners to begin with - which I would call an obsolete technology now. Many rivals have long switched to cylinder wall coatings (like Nikasil) where there is no liner and the aluminium wall itself gets coated instead.

As for cooling, having no liner helps with that too, because aluminium conducts heat much better than steel. A potential problem is how to design large enough cooling channels without weakening the wall of the cylinder too much - because aluminium is also structurally much weaker than steel - but this has generally not been a problem for the production car levels of Nm/L. Once you push the boost high enough, steel liners might become preferable - and that's what you often see on 1000hp+ builds - but for 200-250Nm/L it's not needed. I am sure the Mclaren engine will be pushed much further in the future without major changes.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,120 Posts
Is your Google broken? :mad:

Alright, alright, I will play along! Wet cylinder liner is a liner that's in direct contact with the coolant. This means it basically acts as the sole structure for the wall of the cylinder and needs to be pretty big and heavy - and that's made worse by the fact that the cylinder liner will be made from cast iron. Really, though, I think the main point is that Mclaren have been using cylinder liners to begin with - which I would call an obsolete technology now. Many rivals have long switched to cylinder wall coatings (like Nikasil) where there is no liner and the aluminium wall itself gets coated instead.

As for cooling, having no liner helps with that too, because aluminium conducts heat much better than steel. A potential problem is how to design large enough cooling channels without weakening the wall of the cylinder too much - because aluminium is also structurally much weaker than steel - but this has generally not been a problem for the production car levels of Nm/L. Once you push the boost high enough, steel liners might become preferable - and that's what you often see on 1000hp+ builds - but for 200-250Nm/L it's not needed. I am sure the Mclaren engine will be pushed much further in the future without major changes.
Aha! Very interesting. No way could I have got the extra snippets from Google! So if I understand what you're saying correctly, having a steel, cooled liner could potentially mean that the boost levels could be increased more than if it was an aluminium cylinder wall? This would make sense if they're going to use the same engine in the Super Artura.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
107 Posts
Aha! Very interesting. No way could I have got the extra snippets from Google! So if I understand what you're saying correctly, having a steel, cooled liner could potentially mean that the boost levels could be increased more than if it was an aluminium cylinder wall? This would make sense if they're going to use the same engine in the Super Artura.
Yeah, possibly.

Also, going back to my previous comment, after I wrote it I had done a bit more research and it appears that I might have been a bit too quick to call cast iron cylinder liners obsolete. I normally mostly look at NA engines (since that's what I am interested in) and iron cylinder liners indeed are obsolete there, but for turbocharged engines it seems that liners are still the norm. Ferrari is using them on their 3.9/4L V8 (and likely in their new V6 as well), Maserati is using them on their V6 and even Porsche is using them on the 3.75L F6 in the Turbo (although not in the turbocharged 3L F6 in the base/S/GTS Carrera). So actually it appears that Mclaren could be sort of ahead of the curve with their linerless engine. Although, again, they are only running 21.8PSI of boost for 195Nm/L, while the Ferrari is at 247Nm/L running at 29PSI. Can the Mclaren engine handle more boost without liners? Possibly. Or maybe they'll add liners for more powerful versions - it's not the hardest thing to do engineering wise. Either way I expect the engine to develop a lot more power in the future.
 

·
Premium Member
2021 720S McLaren Orange
Joined
·
192 Posts
I think the new CEO is hell bent on going to hybrid as quickly as possible...by 2026 all Macs will likely be hybrid...and the rumors of an all EV SUV are disappointing...Personally I don’t think you’ll see an LT version of the 750...but perhaps an ‘HS’ version as a final hurrah to ICE. Enjoy the next 2-10 years. Even Ferrari will go full EV sooner than later. For now...hybrid is the name of the game and likely will be until 2030 or so...
Sorry to tell you that the ICE will not be dead. Zero emission fuels will be part of it but we need to overcome the idealization of an ICE combined with an electric motor (aka heavier car) will rule the world. Or the coal burning EV option. I believe a combination of these will be the future. Let the flames begin!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,120 Posts
Sorry to tell you that the ICE will not be dead. Zero emission fuels will be part of it but we need to overcome the idealization of an ICE combined with an electric motor (aka heavier car) will rule the world. Or the coal burning EV option. I believe a combination of these will be the future. Let the flames begin!
🔥1. You're assuming that battery technology will not improve. With marginally lighter batteries, hybrid becomes a bit of a no brainer. With significantly lighter batteries, full electric becomes very compelling.
 

·
Registered
2020 720 Spider
Joined
·
468 Posts
Sorry to tell you that the ICE will not be dead. Zero emission fuels will be part of it but we need to overcome the idealization of an ICE combined with an electric motor (aka heavier car) will rule the world. Or the coal burning EV option. I believe a combination of these will be the future. Let the flames begin!
Petroleum will be around for the rest of our lives and our kids lives...Everything you look at is made with some form of petroleum.

Having said...car manufacturers are being forced to go the hybrid/EV route whether they or we like it or not. This is not a commentary on which is cleaner...It’s a commentary on Govt regulations. We’re also not talking about used cars...we’re talking about new ones. In 10 years time there will be VERY few new fully ICE vehicles for sale on the market. Bio fuels will not likely be fully mainstream and the cost will also be a major factor. The avg. person will be pushed towards and likely even prefer EV in 10 years time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
127 Posts
Can anyone with more experience/knowledge share if McLaren does customer focus groups for their model roadmap? Do they have go-to customers they test out concepts with? What does it take to join that club? Just curious since there are some strong preferences on power plant options.
 
2012 MP4-12C
Joined
·
2,598 Posts
Can anyone with more experience/knowledge share if McLaren does customer focus groups for their model roadmap? Do they have go-to customers they test out concepts with? What does it take to join that club? Just curious since there are some strong preferences on power plant options.
They send out survey emails from time to time, typically when making big model changes. I got one back in January maybe asking about specific desires in a hybrid, preference of hybrid, thoughts on SUV's, some different features, etc. I got another one maybe in February about some other stuff, had some exhaust sound clips to rank. I know I'm on a customer list with corporate and that's probably how I got it.
 
2012 MP4-12C
Joined
·
2,598 Posts
I was thinking about buying a new 720S these days. But when I read this thread here that has become unnecessary. Wait and see how the 750 will be seems to me to be the right tactic.
This is why manufacturers don't talk about new models while older ones are still available to buy. Sales halt if they did.
 
41 - 56 of 56 Posts
Top