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720 depreciation

103K views 501 replies 84 participants last post by  Firstkill 
#1 ·
What do you think a $346k msrp 720s will be worth in 2 years with 4,000 miles? My car is being delivered next week and thinking that will be my time horizon and mileage. I’m assuming that will still be 6 months before spyder arrives.
 
#52 ·
I'm not sure how you come up wit that. You can go to McLaren Chicago and I'm sure other dealers right now and get a brand new '18 while they have a new '19 sitting right next to it. There's plenty of used one's on auto trader. A couple will be on their 3rd owner when they get sold, some have been listed for close to 6 months. Depreciation is going to happen and is currently happening, it's not happening at the rate of the 650s but it's going to depreciate.

While I do agree that it is the best performing car out there, performance isn't always the determine factor when buying these cars. If performance mattered then Ferrari would never sell a car and Lambo would never sell an Aventador much less one that starts at 400k. You said yourself that a dealer would of offered 269k on your 340k car, granted it was a high mileage car but if demand was that great there wouldn't be a hit of over 20% on a trade. There's definitely no long line to get one new or used, you may still pay msrp on a new one but supply is only going to increase, demand will probably stay the same or maybe even lower a tad because it doesn't have the new car hype anymore.
 
#53 ·
I’m with Nadeemy. The 720S is so good I couldn’t possibly think of parting with it at the moment. I’m thinking we trade our 570S Spider for 720S Spider (when it happens) and have both. I’ve had my 720S for a year now and every drive it still amazes me like the first time. It makes even the most mundane drives feel special. Usually cars this fast aren’t fun to drive until you get on a twisty road where you can open them up but the 720S is amazing at ANY speed. They’ve somehow tuned the steering to be just right and dialed in the perfect amount of throttle response to make every speed feel fun without having the jerky hair trigger throttle a Ferrari 458 has. Plus it’s so damned comfortable, the stereo sounds great and it’s so easy to get in and out of.
 
#56 ·
I got mine fully prepared to take a huge hit on it. I've chatted to other owners not wanting to put on too many miles so as to limit the depreciation. One owner was going to transport his car to Monterey in a few weeks so he could minimize the miles. I understand the theory but I cant get on board with it. To miss the drive up through (newly opened) Big Sur is a crime in my books.

Buy the damn thing, thrash the life out of it and live a little. I expect to have one of the highest mileage 720s in the US in a couple of years. Right now it's got a 60cu ft welding helium cylinder in the "boot" that I'm getting refilled this afternoon. It fits in the 720 so why not? I'll draw the line at taking it to Home Depot for the odd bag of grout or cement and I'll try not to stuff 600 lbs of raw bagged Bluefin Tuna in it like I did with my 911 returning from a fishing trip........ but I use the hell out of it and love it :)
 
#60 ·
There is a lot of wishful thinking in this thread. Those who try to sell a 720S are facing a sluggish market and will have to discount between 50 to 80 k from msrp pending on mileage.

With the presentation of the Spider later this year and deliveries starting from late Q1/2019, there will be even more pressure on 720S prices.
 
#61 ·
Different markets are going to react differently.

I, for one am not monitoring resale values. I have zero interest in selling 720s for a very, very long time. Many people on these forums who don't have the cars will continue to monitor cargurus, auto trader and calling dealerships just so they can inform us.

The secondary market is going to be weak for the forseeable future across all car marquees. Yes, someone will point to a one off model and say what it traded for without giving all information (ie., blood bath in the trade in, original owner paying above market value, buying one car and losing substantial amount of money to get another car that doesn't lose value quickly, etc.).

The cars that I personally know which have been sold in the secondary market had some stories behind them; person bought it to stay in line or move up in line for the next car, immigration policies of our current administration, etc.

Now; what I really want to say; mclaren made it a prerequisite that to get a senna, one needed to have a 720s. Early adopters followed the rule but them somehow people started to get senna's without getting 720's and very little car buying history with mclaren. They just don't have any credibility anymore...
 
#63 ·
Let me put in my two cents with actual numbers. I bought a brand new nicely equipped 2018 570S Spider back in March with a MSRP of 254k. I bought it from Mclaren Atlanta and got a great discount of $20,000 so I paid 234K. I put 1400 miles on it since then and loved it but decided I just couldn’t wait and decided to start looking for a 720S. I looked into buying a new one but you just can’t hardly find them. I must have checked every mclaren dealer website for new 720s inventory to only find very few. Most of the ones I have found were preowned and not a huge selection of those either. Now from what I was told from several Mclaren dealers that ordering a new one would take 6 to 8 months to get and especially now that the 600LT and Senna are in production on the same line. Less 720S will be made. So like a lot of people I just don’t want to wait that long when I have the itch for one now. I really wanted a well equipped red or blue one which I couldn’t fine many on the used market in that color at the time. I finally found a Memphis red one with 313 miles on it at Boston Mclaren that stickered at 368K and made a deal on that one. I thought I got a fantastic deal on it for 340K especially considering the miles and that most of the dealers we’re giving no discounts on ordered ones. Boston Mclaren did tell me that they would give me a 10k discount on one if I ordered from them. With that all that said I don’t think 720S prices are dropping significantly especially considering the lack of new ones and the ship time for ordered ones.
 
#69 ·
I’ve heard from a couple of sources I trust that 720 prices were soft in uk. Makes no sense. Is that market more flooded somehow? Also that 12c prices there were much firmer, it seems like ui would be flooded in unwanted 12cs.

I don’t get the disparities on markets. Oversupply or economic downturns in markets i would think would explain it most I guess.

Us stock market is strong right now, supply has been well maintained it seems by McLaren to US this go around, it would explain the tightening I guess.

Anyway, I’m glad to hear it. They have good residuals like this for another 2 or 3 models, and they have a decent chance of shaking off the bad residual reputation as “early growing pains”.
 
#71 ·
The other side of the pond is very small, so having an RHD car that's not hyper/limited F12 TDF, laf etc, tends to follow a much steeper depreciation curve, as a rule of thumb. Used cars are far cheaper, the odds of selling your 720s to Australia or other RHD lands are super slim, it's not exclusive enough. I've seen one under £200k GBP that just sold, £255k RRP with 800 miles on the clock, which is $335k RRP new to $255k resale after 800 miles, but that was the lowest priced car in the UK with Tom Hartley. His gut feeling of where the market really is might be correct though.

An RHD F12 TDF will be always more expensive, by 15% or more maybe, than an LHD config, but the reverse is true for a 720S, where the LHD markets would usually keep prices much better. In short, total addressable market causes the depreciation curve differences.
 
#75 ·
I would disagree that it was undesirable, the spec was spot on. Azores, luxury, sea shell grey, all the city driving stuff possible, etc. It was very very close to my ideal spec for instance, where I wanted a good looking car, with some of the carbon fibre packages but all the touring spec, as I don't do as many track miles, and I wanted an every day.

Without further ado, I kind of agree with Tom Hartley that's where the prices really are, the list price matters less. If I went and sold mine tomorrow, no one would offer me more than £210k(down from £260k ish), I strongly believe that.
 
#79 ·
I think the timing to buy is pretty good right now and will be for 3-4 months. Lots on market and Mclaren just dropped a bunch of new cars on dealers. I’m buying one now and got a very fair deal on a used car.

My hunch is Mclaren pushed a bunch through assembly to satisfy future demand and are now flipping to 600/senna and soon the 720 spider.
 
#87 ·
Everything depreciates. And anyone that believes the 720s hasn’t please try to actually go trade yours in and see what they will offer you.

My buddy purchased 570s with a sticker price of $240s and a year later with 1500 miles he can’t get even $165k for it. Yes the 720s is a different car but look at what happened with 675LT which is at least limited.

In 2020-21 the 720s will be had for $200k or less all day long specially when they come out of warranty and there is nothing wrong with that. It is what it is.
 
#96 ·
Interesting discussion here.

First of all it quite intelligent to buy excotics in an opportunistic way as pre-owned cars don’t carry the typical loss of the first owner.

However it is way more fun to be the first on the block with the new model, and it gets you much better respected as an aficionado. This helps automatically with other acquisitions, specifically if you actually use the car. If you play the game right, it may yield access to cars not easily available, which hold or increase their value. This, however, is getting more difficult as more people understand the “secret” rules.

Wether your “perfect” spec and early delivery is worth to you between 40 and 80 k, is a personal decision.

When trying to figure out the entire picture, you need to take market and dealership into account as well. A new dealer in a small market (if you can find one) is going to be able to help more as an established dealer in a large market with dozens and dozens of customers in line in front of you.

Working with the dealer on their markup (if any) and the finance package (buying all cash ist not always in the dealers best interest) and helping them with their slow moving inventory will help to put the dealer more biased in your favor.

For limited high end models a direct relationship with the manufacturer is a prerogative to stay in the proper information stream and have people available to take your call when pre-orders start.
 
#98 ·
good thread, One thing that hasn't been discussed that will be a factor in depreciation of all our cars is service experience. If Mclaren focuses on making these cars "easy" to own then the values could sustain their current levels. If they fall prey to an ego and the "experience" becomes difficult ... will be many one and done's. and cars will flood market... throw in a change in financial markets and you will see heavy depreciation.

btw .. my experience has been good with service. I've experienced may of the same issues that you guys have but the dealer and mclaren have stepped up.

Make service amazing and painless.... we all can talk most of our friends into them , that and smoking their ass out on the track or street;).

Stay fast !
 
#107 ·
Looks like there are 131 720s for sale on Autotrader now. List prices are dropping into the $280s after the Spider announcement. Will be interesting to see what happens after Spiders are released and when LTs are announced.

For comparison, there are only 50 12Cs for sale for all years (2012-14), 69 650s, 50 675s, and 226 570s.
 
#109 · (Edited)
Well what you see listed (720 and 570 wise) is just a fraction as dealers cannot list all new. Even though some are throwing caution to the wind in order to get stuff sold and getting it all out there (Boston/Charlotte both have everything out for public view). Most dealers (on new cars) keep (720 wise from what I've heard talking with dealers is 3-5 cars ea), so add that to some of the 146 already listed on cars.com.

I really hate to say it, but with economy tanking and McLaren over building, you will see a blood bath in the next 4-6 months (not even adding spider to mix). It's just a fact. As hard as it's been to wait, I am holding out until April and whatever coupes are selling for then, I'll make a game time decision to enjoy for summer.

235 570's is brutal (and that really does not account for many new ones still in dealer warehouses).

No matter what prices do, I think 720 is just the best all around out there--I'm just to the point where waiting 4 months makes the most sense...for me.

PS - (25) Performantes for sale on same site vs (146) 720's vs (144) Ferrari 488's.
 
#110 · (Edited)
Yes RonMath, it appears to be a buyers market!

I'm on the fence about speccing a new 720s EXACTLY how I want it. Until the last month or so my feeeling was, if you're spending 300k-350k+ on a toy, spend a few exrtra bucks for zero compromises on color or options.

But the current ecomnomic uncertainty and money getting more expensive, is really putting negative pressure on the market for such indulgences. To your point there are literalty dozens of 720's out there with less than 1k miles (new and used), that are very close to what I would spec. Some appear to just have delivery miles and are listed as "used"

For savings of 50, 60 or maybe more, the rational side of my brain is prevailing over the emotional side :) As phenomenal as these cars are, a used 720s is just that, a "used" car (Porsche GT and RS cars not withstanding of course). Taking this into account, plus the Spider going on sale, I'm saying a 15% haircut is the starting point for negiotiioatioins on any 2018 that's out there right now.

That said, I've even heard of guys getting 5-6% discounts on brand new specced coupes.
 
#112 ·
Okay, it seems like this thread has gotten a bit of topic. Depreciation on the 720s coupe. I would like to offer a somewhat counter opinion. I love my 720s and I am going to use it as it was engineered. And along that path, if I no longer enjoy it as immensely as I do now, then goodbye.

But I gotta say the 720s on track shines! It is so well balanced. It is way more fun that a GT3. It easily demonstrates its superior handling and power. A complete joy to roll on the throttle and hear those turbos whine.

So what is going to go down in value? Did anyone NOT buy these cars because they thought they were going to go down in value? Please. This is one of the most fun pieces of engineering for the automobile enthusiast in the world. What is the price to play? For me, depreciation is a given when you buy expensive automobiles. No two ways about it unless it is highly collectible.

So can everyone please go get your spiders, and don't procrastinate. The sooner you buy them, the sooner we can move on to an LT variant, and then of course the follow-on spider.:D
 
#114 ·
At the current performance level of the 720s and within budget constraints to not sell a newer car in the super series at more than 320.000 USD I am puzzled what future tech they could use to get a significant gain over the 720s and its 2 years away LT variant ... hypercar high tech is very expensive and does not come at discount prices over night and I am not sure what it would need to really make the next car feel significantly faster within this price range ...
 
#113 ·
I agree Kovalser, a lot of duplicate listings on Autotrader too. Nonetheless, there are a lot of 720's out there right now.

And just a point of clarification on my post above.

I'm talking 15% off of leftover 2018's that are new, or have been titled with delivery miles, and are priced at or close to MSRP. As a starting point.
 
#116 ·
To Gum. Addition of a hybrid electric power train will not necessarily hurt existing values. If anything it will help them. As the world evolves to electrification, there will be plenty of us who want a pure IC platform (think air cooled Porsche).

To the current 720s owners who think their platform won’t depreciate because you’re keeping your own 720s’- you’re wrong. That ship has sailed. We are already seeing $60k plus depreciation in a one year old car and $20k on a current year 2019. Add another 20% supply when the 720s spiders arrive and you will see huge depreciation. Maybe not 12c/650s depreciation but $220-240k pricing seems likely within the next 12-18 months.
 
#117 ·
Who knows what it will be 18 months from now--way too many variables (economy is primary) to even venture a guess. You are just tossing numbers out. If you see $220 720's we will be in a recession (which we might).

If that is the case you will see all exotic brands tank--Lambo, Ferrari, etc...

Buy where you are comfortable and enjoy.
 
#128 ·
My sales manager told me this last weekend that they are offering $230-240k on 720s trade ins. What puzzles me is that a 2015 Huracan which had as sticker of $230k is still selling for $200k give or take $5-10k depending on mileage. So it has barely taken a 10% hit in 4 years. That is strong resale despite making more than 8,000 Huracans so far.
 
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#129 ·
if you just might look at IG or some other Lambo news the Huracan just took about a 10-15% hit the last 24hrs in used prices ... ;-) as did the Performante ;-)
 
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